Are YouTube, MySpace causing teen girls to attack?

In yet another headline-grabbing muddle of cause and effect, just about everyone (including this website) is trumpeting a story about eight Florida teens who've been charged with beating up a 16-year-old girl "so they could make a videotape to post on YouTube."  The girl lost part of her sight and hearing.

The girl's father is quoted saying the alleged assailants lured his daughter into a trap "for express purpose [sic] of filming the attack and posting it on the Internet."

And, of course, the attack was apparently a retaliation for mean comments the victim had posted on her MySpace profile.

And now, local groups are apparently calling on video hosting sites to prohibit videos that depict fighting.

There are many, many high school-age fight videos on YouTube. Just search "school fight" and order the results by date.  Kids of all genders, colors, ages and nationalities are fighting, all over the world. And obviously, there's often a kid with a cellphone present to record it.

But here's a moment to be wary of hasty conclusions.  Before we turn into a society of cart-drawn horses that blames everything on the proliferation of digital and the consequent extinction of morality, let's wait until we get some science happening. 

In this case, you'd want to start with the question: Are kids fighting more frequently now? 

If yes, are a significant portion of those fights instigated so that they can be recorded? Or would those fights have happened anyway?

And perhaps just as importantly, if you prevented kids from uploading fight videos to YouTube, would it decrease the number of fights happening in the first place?

And if you shut down MySpace and erased all the hurtful comments posted thereon, same question.

Why are YouTube and MySpace the primary suspects here?  Why not the makers of the video camera the kids were using, or the electric company that supplied the power to charge it?  If there were no electricity, would we see the number of schoolyard fights decrease?  Not likely.

Connecting new technology to violence is always a good way to make waves. Comic books, TV, movies and video games have all been put on trial -- and now it's the Web's turn.  Trouble is, the more of those connections we make, the less convincing each one gets.

Comments

[Ornstein]

Sarno, I hope you're the next victim of one of these teenage "fight" videos. I can't wait to sit back with a bowl of popcorn and laugh my batootsie off. Jerk.

[David Sarno]

Ornstein: did you want to explain why you're hoping someone is going to kick my "batootsie" and videotape it? I didn't quite follow your reasoning.

[Sabrina]

Unfortunately, such fights have gone on long before youtube and myspace was thought of. Now it's just an opportunity for evildoers to exploit their evil. Yes, those internet organizations should definitely draw the line at such things. What if the girl had wound up killed like in the similar case of a 14 year old girl in British Columbia, Canada back in 1997? Would those girls had been so proud to show that off? I hope each and every one of them go to jail for a very long time.

[steve]

The ,dare i say it, interesting side of this is that this is seen as a form of entertainment. I was bullied and picked on for many years at school in the UK .I was a teachers kid and thus an easy target . Bullies and the violence are not new .What is new is the level of either indifference or casual acceptance of it . Now we have kids and bullies filming these attacks as a form of trophy collecting , as entertaining footage of sometimes random attacks (happy slapping) or just basic thuggery . My only hope is that if you film your moronic behaviour you get prosecuted for the violence you display . But why bother when we actively promote cage fighting . You get what you deserve as a society.

[Roger Krueger]

There have been evil schoolkids that bully and beat other schoolkids forever. We should be grateful that the internet has given these Neanderthals such a glorious opportunity for self-incrimination.

[GetReal]

What's the big deal, here? When I was their age we punched and kicked each other way more often. Nothing that parents could not resolve, nobody died, nobody was stabbed or shot in many, many years. The worst thing that happened was a black eye. Kids need to vent, too and establish hierarchy. This society cannot stand for itself and use common sense and values - you need police for a girls' fight? Omg, all you're doing is making these kids hold it back until they can't take it anymore and then they start shooting each other.

[Tom J]

GetReal, you are so not. Everyone I grew up with managed to make it through school without fighting, and I have no idea why you think it should be a required part of the curriculum.

Yes, video is pushing things to higher levels as well as higher frequencies. See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_slapping
for what's happening in the UK. And yes, 'craze' is an appropriate name for it.

I am really tired of excusing unacceptable behavior by claiming it's always been done so there's nothing and no one to blame. Rubbish!

[KWinn]

Make the perpetrators Black and we'd see more outrage than what i'm reading or hearing. On Nancy Grace last night it was a parade of people excusing their behavior. It also stated that they were laughing in their cells and asking were they going to miss cheerleading practice? That tells me that they have grown up in a "it's my world" mode where they have never paid for their actions.

[Lynn]

Get Real, you're an idiot. I, too, managed to get through school, as did all of my friends, without fighting like animals. Your criteria for acceptable behavior is that no one gets killed. This was not a fight both agreed to, in an open place like a schoolyard (which I don't agree with either), this was eight punks luring an unsuspecting teen into a house, locking the door and beating her half to death. If whatever unlucky spawn you manage to produce are ever on the receiving end of the same, let's see how you feel then.

I hope the little rag who was the main perp has the book thrown at her.

It's obvious that people's behavior changes when a camera is present, especially teens who like to show off. I don't think YouTube is going away, but to say they are not complicit is disingenuous, at best. The only good aspect, as was mentioned above, is the the dummies incriminate themselves, and that is very useful.

[ZPP]

Who are the parents of these "kids"? Their names ought to be published in the paper next to their "little darlings". Violence in the home begets violence in society. 10 to 1 these kids were either "spanked" (also known as hit/beaten) or not given any boundaries or guidance about matters of moral conscience.

I was "spanked" and I got therapy in time to treat my young children with respect, dignity and appropriate guidelines. Anyone can heal the ills of their youth, with effort and trust.

I am glad these violators put their actions on video so their actions can be witnessed by others and so that they can receive the help that they need to become responsible adults, one day.

Peace.

ZPP

[denise beyer]

I think that is brutal and defendents should get more than what they are charged with.
they need to be charged with assualt and treated as in adult.
I dont think my space and you tube should have nothing to do with it, I think the parents
should be responsible for their kids actions.
I would kick my kids a** if they pull that ..................

[lawrence]

The writer says that there is muddled cause and effect in banning fight videos, but I think that he is confusing cause and effect. Proponents of the ban do not claim that they will end or reduce fighting, they want to ban the videos because it is disgusting to videotape beatings. Sarno writes: "are a significant portion of those fights instigated so that they can be recorded? Or would those fights have happened anyway?" No one is claiming that the beatings would not have happened if there was no way of videotaping it - yes, most of the recorded fights (but not all) would have happened anyway.

What amazes me is that you really think that the ban is intended to reduce violence. The main point is to stop glorifying violence, and to stop providing a public space to watch this sick stuff.

[Mike (a guy who's afraid of society, not the internet)]

Sarno, your comments are dead on and 100% correct. This is a societal problem.

Think back to those high school girls in northern Illinois (Glenbrook North High School) who taped their violent assault of the freshman participants in the Powder Puff Football game. YouTube didn't even exist at the time. Does this mean that video recording technology is the enemy? That a camcorder is a loaded weapon in the hands of a teenage girl?

Get real, people. Too many Americans are motivated by their fear of the unknown. These posts convince me that, once again, people want to blame something only because they don't fully comprehend the situation.

[Bilkees Ghoghawala]

why would the victim post horrible comments on myspace account.? I think the victim should be the person responsible for the event. Dont get me wrong. the whole beating is very scary for the rest of the parents. Dont matter whether You are a parent of a victim or the violaters. Also. , i think this all boils down to Too many rights given to the young teenagers as adults and too early to make them ADULTS at the early age. They donot have a clue what goes on in the real world. I personally hate Myspace and utube accounts......

[Amalia Smith]

I totally disagree, my space and u-tube are not the blame for this situation. Its too bad that the girl was beat up and lost partial sight and vision. The girls most likely posted the fight to prove a point. If the girl posted ugly things on the internet they were getting there revenge the same wayposting her beat-down on the internet.
My neighbor's daughter had a simular exsperience the only difference was the girls attack her on the way home from school. There was no my space, camera phones or u-tubes to post videos (early 2000). Her "crime" was talking about the other girls.

[clarence]

i think they should get beat up like they beat her up it is only right i call on everybody in florida to treat them the way they treated her

[clarence]

somebody should beat them down like that because they only jumped her because they knew they could win it is really sad it takes 6 people to jump one little girl those girls mothers are just as guilty they need to be charged in the worst way i bet there parents would not like it if there daughters beaten like that the two guys are punks they need to be dealt with to like the prison way no what i mean

[notacow]

The problem is that this generation is so adverse to sex, that they are turning to other outlets. While this generation (the past 10 years) may be the most boring, least creative, or least original in decades, they do manage to do something better...injure and kill each other.

[k09]

first, i am appalled at some of you and your comments especially getreal. any kind of fighting in my opinion is inexcusable. and for you to condone these actions is incredibly moronic on your part. people are getting hurt to the extent that it ruins their lives, and you call that ok cause poeple need to vent and establish heirarchy!
im in highschool and all the years i have been in school there has been but one fight. we get along just fine, screw heirarchy. i dont know anyone that needs to vent that bad, so much so, that they have to mess up someones sight and hearing.
and zzp, i agree with the overall message but i have a beef about the whole spanking deal. i was smacked and spanked as a little kid when i did wrong. i am just fine now. i have a good head on my shoulders and know right from wrong.
and as for those kids parents, let me tell you, that was all those kids faults. not the parents. were they in the room? or were they hitting that poor girl. no. those kids are fully to blame for their actions no matter how bad their childhood was or how bad their homelife is. they know that what they did was wrong.. and what they were doing was wrong. they have a conscience and brain. they can make their own decisions. they made a bad one.

[Kristopher]

No youtube caused these girls to get caught.

[Ron]

The media will always find a scapegoat for violence. When I grew up they blamed the three stooges and comic book violence. Then they blamed movies. Now it's You Tube.
Let's get real and put the blame where it belongs: Square on the shoulders of the parents.
The girls involved in the video beating in Florida obviously had no moral values, judging by their behavior after they were arrested. It's too bad they don't arrest the parents right with them.

[natasha]

hey people im bearly 13 yrs old and i have got in so many times and i still fights because fighting with the girls is just my pasion fighting is really good for all the peple.

[Jan]

holy crap. I wasn't able to watch the video halfway through. I had to stop it. this girl lost part of her sight and hearing because of being beaten up so brutally in this very clip. i feel sick now, disgusting!

[Josh]

People freak out about all the wrong things. Fights, yes has been around for years. Kids will be kids. Yes sometimes it gets out of hand. People, in general, need to stop trying to turn this wonderful nation into a nation of laws and censors. I understand that some people think, well if there is no laws then there will be criminals running wild, but if there were no laws to break, certain people wouldnt be considered criminals. Censorship is another big issue. Everyone doesnt want to be the Cleavers. Dont put blame on companies and corporations that they have to watch what they put on TV radio or the internet. Step your game up as a parent and monitor what your kids are doing. Dont let them watch TV all day, dont let them surf the internet and go into chat rooms. Its your responsibility as a parent to filter things that you dont want to influence your child. Leave them alone, suspend them from school, and go on with life. Instead of being on here reading about teen violence, and checking your myspace. Take your kid out to dinner, go on a walk, shopping, something!