Breaking News: Hillary Clinton now thinks Karl Rove's a political genius

Until very recently -- like suddenly this afternoon -- Karl Rove was to most Democrats the Great Satan, the political mastermind of two outrageously stunning Republican presidential victories by a Texas goofball governor and, before that, the unfortunate upset ousting of a popular Democratic governor named Ann Richards, as well as the overall rejuvenation of the Lone Star state GOP in statewide offices.

In fact, there are few things politically evil that Rove has not been blamed for by Democrats, even nine months after he exited the White House to write a book, consult and opine in Newsweek, the Wall Street Journal and as an analyst for Fox News.

In recent months one of the worst things Sen. Hillary Clinton could say about her chief opponent, Sen. Barack Obama, was that he was taking moves out of the "Karl Rove playbook." Can you imagine?! "Shame on you, Barack Obama!" she said. Which, if you stop to think about it, means Obama was being successful.

So successful, in fact, that the Illinois freshman senator, ahead in delegates and popular votes, is on the brink of snatching the party's nomination and even acting like the presumptive nominee, ignoring Clinton and taking on who's-its from Arizona.

For his part, a year ago Rove was saying Clinton was the prohibitive favorite for the Democratic presidential nomination and then, later, he said she was a tremendously flawed candidate with extremely high negatives for a national candidate. Both true at the time.

How quickly things change in this season's presidential politics.

Today, Clinton began citing Rove as the ultimate expert on who was the strongest Democratic candidate in the Nov. 4 general. And we've got the exclusive maps below to prove it, all four confidential pages.

No, really!

Campaigning in Kentucky today for tomorrow's....

...primary vote, Clinton sought to justify why she's staying in a race it's virtually impossible for her to win mathematically. She said, as she often does, "There has been a lot of analysis about which of us is stronger to win against Sen. McCain, and I believe I am the stronger candidate."

Fine. Very familiar.

Then, she veered off into new territory. "Just today," Clinton said, "I found some curious support for that position when one of the TV networks released an analysis done by -- of all people -- Karl Rove, saying that I was the stronger candidate. Somebody got a hold of his analysis and there it is."

In his short tenure as TV analyst Rove has become famous for his 8x10 colored U.S. maps showing whatever he's trying to demonstrate. He's long been renowned among co-workers for mining details and all sorts of fascinating tidbits from material that others completely missed.

His latest four pages of Fox maps (see below) show Clinton leading the presumptive Republican nominee, Sen. John McCain, by more than 50 electoral votes in a hypothetical match-up based on current state polls. And another Rove map shows Obama trailing McCain slightly.

In an e-mail this evening Rove confirmed his most recent data does indeed show what Clinton is citing. And he passed along copies of his copyrighted maps, which we are publishing below.

O.K., now let's see what this is really about. So Rove, the Republican Svengali of modern American politics, is really saying that Clinton is stronger because he wants Democrats to pick her because he secretly knows that she really isn't stronger and that will backfire and actually help the GOP's McCain.

Or, no, wait. Maybe Rove is really saying Clinton is stronger now because he knows Democrats won't believe him so then they'll do the opposite and choose Obama, which is really what Rove wants because he knows McCain is stronger against the freshman senator.

That's probably it. Because Rove couldn't possibly be telling the truth.

-- Andrew Malcolm

CLICK ON THE MAP AND SCROLL THROUGH ALL 4 PAGES

Photo Credits: AP
Maps courtesy of KarlRove&Co.

Comments

[HigherMinds]

Informed Choice Is Real Power -- This video from youtube contains information that everyone needs to know about what is happening to the privacy of our personal information and how it's being used as a political tool by candidates via the Internet.

http://www.youtube.com/user/KlearTruth

Please share this with everyone you know because everyone deserves the opportunity to make an informed choice about who has access to their personal information.

[John Quimby]

He's loving this.

[cnnr]

first she starts politicking and attacking her opponent in a Rovian way, then she starts quoting Rove. Nice. She just tied the knot with the Republican Party.

[cnnr]

Doesn't she realize that nobody cares anymore? Everybody but her and her staunchest supporters has moved on.

[Jack]

I'm going to comment on Rove's map rather than Clinton's statement.

It's far too early to assume that states with, say, a 4-6 point difference will go the way the polls say today. May polls tend to be poor indicators of November election results. I might make an exception for moderately close states that are leaning towards the party which has traditionally won the state, as is the case in South Dakota.

Also, I wouldn't make any assumptions about a traditional swing state like NH with a slightly larger difference.

Taking away these close states, it is clear that Obama has a good shot in November.

[Ryan]

Karl Rove is saying HILLARY is the stronger candidate for ONE REASON ONLY!

He knows the Republicans will probably lose to either candidate and he thinks Clinton would be the better President. Almost all Republicans know Obama would be a disaster for our country. Furthermore, he fears Obama's tax policies and foreign policy ideas and knows Clinton would offer a much more moderate policy. That's why he's showing Clinton some "support."

[Jerry Tsai]

Rove's analysis is worth examining, even if Clinton wants to uses it to tout her candidacy.

What I see: The maps are based on poll results, which are unstable. The most notable feature is Clinton's rise in poll numbers starting one month ago. This, frankly, does not make that much sense. She's not that much a better candidate today than she was one month ago.

Keep in mind that Senator Obama (and the Republicans) have pretty much ignored Clinton during that time. If any of them decided to highlight Clinton's ample flaws, her poll numbers would no doubt return to where they were a month before, and the maps would look far different. Thus, whlie the maps are based on real data (presumably), to validate Clinton's candidacy by citing poll numbers for an election to be held half a year from now when nobody is using any time or money pointing out why she is not a good candidate would be foolish.

But then in the world of Clintonian math, the only metrics that matter are the ones that she says matter.

[mike diaz]

I'm a democrat if the election is Hillary and McCain i will vote for Hillary and she will be our next president ..... if is Obama and McCain i will vote for McCain and McCain will win by a landslide. I have always voted democrat.

[redwoodtreehugger]

Very embarrassing, Hillary.

[Andrew Austin]

He's saying it because it's true. Just because you don't like his politics doesn't mean his analysis is incorrect. I loathe Karl Rove. And he is very smart when it comes to electoral politics. No contradition there. In fact, if he wasn't so smart we wouldn't know about him and therefore could not hate him.

[Willie in Kansas]

Karl Rove was the Great Satan. Karl Rove is Satan, the Angel tossed from Heaven, the Judas of the working class American. Karl Rove taught Lucifer everything he knows. He has no morals, no ethics, no religion. We call this piece of walking elephant dong, a political mastermind? Yeah, I want to throw up in his face, have this Kodak moment, just frame it and put it in the GOP Hall of Notoriety or Infame, whatever (LOL). Are Rove and Ann Coulter married to each other? Yeah, I'd trade her for a Camel in Morroco. I hate her too. Only in America, scum like Rove attract the attention he does. He is no genious, if he were he would have steered clear of Bush if he cared for his country men. He doesn't, but his manipulative, evil ways have given birth to a new movement. Conservative does not equal Republican. I'm a conservative, and Karl Rove does not speak for me. He doesn't believe in anything I believe. Then again, I would understand any drunken woman impregnated by him wanting to have an abortion. The guy is just hideous looking. Yeah, rally the sheep, appeal to their prejudice, incite anger frustration, give them piece meal information. Twist the meaning of words and phrases. Kill the homos, kill the rag-head, deport the Mexicans, even those born in the USA, put the Cubans back in an inner-tube, push them away, and poke a hole in it. All these people that have never done anything but to pursue their American dream are the victims of Rove and his antics. Yes, he has indeed succeeded in getting Bush in the White House. Now people are scrapping and having to choose between food and oil. Yeah, by the way is the fault of the liberals and the people who hate us. Maybe is because there are no homos in Iran. Bush, Cheney, Chavez and the Iranians are rolling in the big oil dough. What US Combat Veterans and the American Family get? Our sons and daugthers in a body bag. Yes, Rove is quite an accomplished piece of Nazi Kraftwerk. I hope he gets AIDS it would serve him right.

[NinaK]

Like many of us have been saying: Hilliary will do anything, say anything, and act any way to try and convince voters she is the one and only one who can be President. The fact is, she has already proven she is not fit to lead our nation.....since she cannot even run a good campaign, cannot pick decent and knowledgable people to be her managers, cannot manage the campaign budget, and cannot tell the truth, how could anyone in their right mind want her to be our President and Commander-in-Chief? She might be good at "reciting" policy, but obviously is sorely lacking in all other areas. Integrity, Honest, Wisdom, good leadership, good steward of finances, and making the right decisions count far much more than being able to recite policy.

Oregon, please, let's end Hilliary's madness.

[NinaK]

Like many of us have been saying: Hilliary will do anything, say anything, and act any way to try and convince voters she is the one and only one who can be President. The fact is, she has already proven she is not fit to lead our nation.....since she cannot even run a good campaign, cannot pick decent and knowledgable people to be her managers, cannot manage the campaign budget, and cannot tell the truth, how could anyone in their right mind want her to be our President and Commander-in-Chief? She might be good at "reciting" policy, but obviously is sorely lacking in all other areas. Integrity, Honest, Wisdom, good leadership, good steward of finances, and making the right decisions count far much more than being able to recite policy.

Oregon, please, let's end Hilliary's madness.

[08vote]

The last piece of the kitchen sink strategy.

Hillary will continue to campaign in Montana and S. Dakota because she can't let down her pretense of having a possible shot at the Democratic Nomination. In the meantime, Bill Clinton is also propping up her with his false sense of security. Hillary may deliver her swan song in Montana, population of 300 people - in her mind, the best place to mitigate any embarrassment of losing by giving a concession speech in a state that doesn't count for much, anyway.

[Barbara]

Mike Diaz, I guess I can blame you then when Social Security is privatized, women lose abortion rights, unions lose power and we are in a 100 year war in Iraq. Maybe you should rethink your strategy of voting for McCain out of spite.

[M. E. Steadmann]

Democrats who claim they will vote McCain if Obama is the Democratic nominee should really take a long hard look at themselves and think about where they stand politically, or if they even have any political philosophy at all.

If they are truly Democrats, why vote for a Republican when you can vote Nader? Nader is certainly closer to the Democrats on many policy issues. That would make much more sense than swinging all the way to the right, plus a vote for Nader would have a healthy effect on the nation. A third party might be just the thing we need to keep our leaders -- from the two major parties -- honest.

Unless, of course, these so-called Democrats are really, really racist or really, really sexist.

The Steadmanns

[Pat]

Looking at the data, McCain has dropped and Obama has moved up in EC just in the past week. The race isn't even started, so we have, at best, a snapshot that is open to many changes over the next months, especially after both parties have had their conventions. Why is Karl doing this? Part of his mischief -- he wants Clinton to hang in there for as long as she can and he wants to create a myth that Obama won't win. As Karl well knows -- tell a lie often enough and some people will believe it.

Remember,Kerry won the popular vote and lost the EC by a single state: Ohio. Bush won a first term on a single state: FL and with the help of a Supreme Court. This race is too close to call, and will likely remain so on Election Night.

[Jim H]

Rove is mostly effective when he can turn his enemies into gibbering idiots by worrying about what he means, what he's "got up his sleeve." Maybe not much, you know? It's just the latest numbers, with what seems to be a wildly rosy picture of Republican politics. His numbers were way off in 2006, too. He doesn't understand what gives now.

[BWare]

Hillary citing Rove as the authoritative reference, presumably a man of profound wisdom and insight?

Never thought I'd see the day. I'm opening the next piece of mail I get from Publishers Clearinghouse...

[Miri NY]

This is no surprise.
Like Rove having no experience (unless you also believe Laura Bush has experience) & a bad resume, 6 Y on the Walmart Board & a husband who is in bed w/ Dubai you play the race card against your opponent.
Hill, he' not a genius. He just does it better than you do. It's hard to fake it, especially when you have a large state who resent being stuck w/ a racist carpetbagger like you.
Don't worry Hill, Obama will carry NY in a landslide. May be slippage on people like Rangel, Nadler, etc. who forced you on us in the 1st place. (But better decent Republicans than the corrupt Dems who have tolerated yr racist tantrums.
CA is similar, except they haven't had to put up w/ you.
See Hill yr problem isn't that yr a woman. Yr problem is you have no talent for politics.

[laughing at the dems]

this is what now passes for news ? how is this not in the OpEd section ? This sound as if it was (poorly) written by one the newly eligible wedding brides in california. All emotion, no facts

but hey, that is how the dems role, sho' yo' right.

The truth is, this is just a replay of 2000. Dems were screaming and whining and trying to change all the rules then. They are a disaster.

[Wonkers]

Rove is playing this one like a fiddle. He knows Hillary's weaknesses and is reeling her in like a fish. Disinformation is his forte. My take is that he has already figured that Obama is the stronger opponent, but by dividing the Democrats with statistical obfuscation for as long as possible, it gives McCain a chance to repeat the mantra and hopefully gain traction.

[ABE]

For the LA TIMES to legitimize congenital liar, thief,
and criminal Karl Rove, is inexcusable!?!

(Did you actually read the item? Try it again. Because it's Sen. Clinton who's citing him as an expert.)

[aramps]

I can think of more than a few potential veeps that would blow these projections out of the water.

I am not suggesting that Rove's numbers are inaccurate, just that "anyone but Dan Quayle or Tom Eagleton" is not the full picture here.

[Bill]

I find it interesting that the GOP would spend time and effort to create a map of which states McCain would win and yet clearly nobody read the constitution. McCain cannot run for president! He is NOT a Natural Born Citizen as is required to hold the office of president. Of course that will not stop him from running, as the GOP is evil.

[Guillermo Lucero Funes]

Or he is doing it because there is no way a Republican would win this elections and Hillary and the Clinton clan are still playing for the lobbies and would not really make the change every decent American is waiting for the next presint to do. End this no sense war and bring this country back to reality. How are we expecting from people from around the world to believe in us if we don't respect ourselves. How we'll make them believe we are there to bring them democracy, if democracy doesn't exist any more in America. Today we are using the Koran for shooting practice in Irak. What's next. Thay can lie to us, we are the ones that make the choice on believing them or not. WAR IS OVER , if you want it.

[Richard P. McDonough]

This reprehensible woman is a soul mate of that reprehensible man. A Clinton-Rove ticket for the Knownothings, perhaps?

[jennifer potenciano]

there’s something deeply, nay dangerously, disturbing about american politics today. & once this is known—even at this late stage of the dems nominating contest--the better for america & the world in general.

caveat, voters in tomorrow’s oregon primary.

what’s wrong with the american electorate in this year’s presidential elections?

the question in this fall’s elections ought not to be the clash between two pioneering candidates, between a woman (albeit, white) american hopeful & an afro-american (black) aspirant, between racism & sexism. (sooner or later, there’ll be an american lady president, a black u.s. chief executive.) ironically, it’s the “phony” (to quote one favorite word of the black candidate) issue that’s been twisted & tortured & made to seem inevitable by the black prexy wannabe, obama.

one thing oregon voters--& the american electorate in general--must realize is that the afro-american is so astute & wily & deliberate in cultivating this “phony” issue, such that everything that hillary says & does is automatically labeled “racist” & thus raking up a “phony” issue. this even while hillary is always put on the defensive by her enemy’s knee-jerk, habitual, consistent employment of the race card & the complementing equally destructive sexism weapon, w/ hillary always at the receiving end.

to be sure, there are other issues & other weapons for hillary’s destruction that obama has skillfully nurtured as part of his vast arsenal of contraptions against hdc. designed to totally destroy, these WHDs are comparable to the late iraqi strongman, saddam hussein’s long-dreamt of WMDs. obama is a master of “psy-war,” using tactics & strategies that are better suited for a low-road campaign, all slanted towards making hillary look like a witch, & himself (obama) a halo’d saint, so to say.

you, oregon voters & the rest of the american electorate have, by now, read, of course, joan vennochi’s highly revealing news feature (titled “the change we can believe in?”—yes, in a question mark!) on the wily obama in the may 11, 2008 edition of the boston globe, have you? the self-declared “change agent” is unmasked as a “phony” messiah, ditching his pastor wright when it was politically convenient to do so; discouraging revotes in michigan & florida since it would help hillary, not him; & dishing out ordinary political carpetbagger’s spoutings; his flap, if double-faced ways, on nafta; his equally double-standard behavior towards lobbyists when he was a state & u.s. senator, & now as prexy wannabe; & other dr. jekkyl-mr.hyde track record on other issues. (other equally revealing accounts about obama have seen the light of print, i just wonder why you, the great american people, choose to still paint obama as lily-white.)

& yet you, oregon voters, you american people would rather fall for this phony man, who’s a master at pulling everybody’s legs, who’s only expertise is a glib-tongued oratorical prowess?

is this the candidate you want, a black fakir of a snake oil salesman? & you’d ignore, even demonize, the decidedly better-prepared, better qualified nominee like hillary rodham clinton?

better wake up, guys, get back to your senses, before you regret your decision, before it’s too late.

[mle]

Answer this, Hillary supporters - six months ago in December, who did the polls show would win the Democratic party nomination? How accurate are those six months later in May '08?

And for you so-called Democrats clamoring to vote for McCain in November, why the bitter attitude? Stop whining. Stick to your guns and vote for McCain with pride and happiness like all the idiots who voted for Bush in '00 and '04. And don't complain if he wins - be proud of the vote you made for U.S jobs, women's rights, our fighting soldiers, our gas prices, our energy policies, etc. Live with it for four more years with a smile - you can make it happen.

I know I'll be proud of my vote regardless, but you worry about showing those elitist Obama supporters who's boss, you smart tools, you :-)

[Benjamin]

Ryan said "Almost all Republicans know Obama would be a disaster for our country."

Ryan, after the last 8 years if there is one thing that is obvious, it's that republicans don't know how to run a country, let alone who would be good at running the country. We currently have the worst president since Herbert Hoover and you want us all to care what the republican opinion is? Republicans have no credibility right now. They spent it all on a Bush's folly, the invasion of Iraq and ignored the massive corporate corruption at every level of the country, from the mortgage lenders up to the derivatives trade.

Now we are sadlled with record debts and deficits and we're bleeding money in a war with Iraq while we're simultaneously entering the retirement of the baby boomers. Republicans know two things about what makes a good leader, Jack and s**t, and Jack just left town.

[awlswll]

Rove knows the electoral map better than anyone. How do you think Bush got elected twice? The SuperDelegates "in-the-know" are fully aware of this issue w/Obama and this could easily turn up at the convention.
Remember: It took a Clinton to clean-up after Bush I and it will take another Clinton to clean-up after Bush II.

[Mike]

This is so transparent that it's hardly worthy of a Karl Rove tactic. At this point Obama has the nomination virtually locked up. Rove digs up some stats to support a candidate that will not get nominated, causing her supporters to be disillusioned by the whole process, creating further division within the Democratic party, weakening Obama's support for general election.

The scary part is, there are only two possible conclusions to draw regarding Clinton - either she is unable to see through Rove's tricks, which makes me question her intelligence, or she is fully aware of this and is behind the concept of furthering the divide, which gives me chills. So she's either dumb or evil, neither of which are very glowing conclusions.

[allison, california]

Rove's map is not the only indicator showing Obama would lose to McCain but McCain would lose to Hillary.
Infact such indicator is even stronger!
Check this more netral source:

www.http://www.electoral-vote.com/

Go Hillary! Go McCain!

[Digangi]

Hillary and Bill know something that we all may not know. How can one trail in popular votes, trail in pledged delegates, trail in number of states won and trail in the number of super delegates claim to be the best than one who has achieved all those accolades? And all given by the people/voters rather than self-claimed. Whose intelligence is she trying to play with?

It is wrong and stupid to assume that because Bill Clinton survived the impeachment, Hillary will survive the second rate performance in the nomination. Bill was saved not by his genius or persistence but by the majority of the democratic supporters that were behind him. Such majority supporters are no longer with the Clintons but Barack. How much does it take for Bill and hillary to figure to figure this? Shame on them.

[EyeDubya]

Wrap a blatant falsehood with truth, and the gullible will swallow — that's the Rove strategy. That's exactly what he has done with these maps. For the most part, the maps render truly the current balance among the candidates, with two very notable exceptions. There is no way that Obama will lose Iowa and Wisconsin, and there's plenty of existing polling to color these states Blue should he be the nominee. Rove must lie about these two states to give aid and comfort to the Clinton camp. Why else do you think that Clinton campaign chief Terry McAuliffe cut an endorsement spot for Faux News Channel stating that it was indeed "Fair & Balanced"?

Lest anyone forget, FNC Overlord Rupert Murdoch played host to a Clinton fundraiser last year. Murdoch, Rove & Co. want to prevent at all costs the nomination of Obama, the one candidate who would offer Americans a chance to repudiate the Bush legacy utterly.

[Fernando F.]

Rove is going to say that Hillary is the strongest Democratic candidate because he thinks Democratic people will vote for her believing she will defeat McCain. Please! Is just the opposite. Rove is never going to say that Obama is the strongest so he can win the nomination and defeat McCain. American People: he is just lying!!! Is a trick. Nobody says out loud what is his weakness. He is a strategist.

[T Ross]

Clinton supporters are off their rockers ! Do they not realize that Rove is A Republican who wants to the white house to remain republican, therefore he tries his best to persuade the under-informed Billary Clinton nut jobs that they have the "best chance to beat McCain", thereby causing said under-informed to make even worse endorsements of a candidate who was dead in the water long before her campaign even started!?

Or do they not care to question the status quo because it makes life a lot easer ( in the short run that is)?

[John Thomas]

Rove is such a genius, that his political maoeuverings helped the Republicans loose both the house and senate in 2006, and has set up the Republicans to loose not only a vast majority of other government seats, but the presidency as well. Lets hope he keeps helping the Republicans for years to come.

[T Ross]

Mike Diaz-

Do not, in the same statement, claim to be a democrat and then write that you will vote McCain if Obama is the Democratic nominee.

From that statement it is clear that you are a cretin on your best day!

[EmilyD]

Please tell us why you neglected to mention in your article that Karl Rove has been consulting for John McCain for months now? That fact certainly colors Mr. Rove's map and everything he says with the tinge of conflict-of-interest. For more than 91 days Think Progress (www.thinkprogress.org) has been tracking the fact that Fox News has also omitted this fact about Rove when he appears as a talking head on the network. I hate to think that the LA Times has become as "fair and balanced" with it's reporting as Fox News is. Personally I'd prefer ACCURATE!

[Chris]

This is hysterical ! I just can't stop laughing while watching so many democrats beat themselves up ! All 3 candidates are losers. Nader just doesn't count. How about Ron Paul. Another idiot. We are approaching some very dark days as far as our gov't is headed. Hopefully after 4 years of idiocy another Reagan will emerge. And, maybe the republicans can fix the mess you've created.

[PrakashP]

No Matter what GOP will loose this election. Any one can easily win this election against GOP, American people are fed up with Bush and want to remove the party of the white house as soon as possible. So no matter who is Dem nominee, Clinton or Obama or some XYZ, they can have a easy victory.

[Sonny James]

I don't get it.

If Karl Rove....Bush's Top Strategist... is so smart, why is Bush...the worse president in U.S. History?

[mike king]

Republicans
A very large portion of the posters here wouldn’t make the same remarks in mixed company or are oblivious to the hate spewing forth either from one direction or the other.
Fortunately, extreme intolerance coupled with “Decider” arrogance has insulted the majority of Americans and will be apparent either in the polls or on the streets.
The more Republican extremists “hate” Obama, the Centrist voters are pushed to him. Lets face it, he’s a Senator with good standing, good service and is a thoughtful man. The more the fools demonize him, the more fanatical they appear.

ObamaFreaks
Listen to your candidate! If we are to come to a common greater good, it takes inclusion not derision.
McCain is a good Senator with good standing, good service and a message that he is committed to. So is Obama. I seriously doubt either would approve of or repeat most the content in this blog

Hillary Fantatics
Hillary is a Senator with good standing, good service and a large fanatically protective following that has hurt her more than helped her. Unfortnately, Hillary would (does) approve of the diatribe and kitchen sunk gutter politics. Which is the deciding factor in her current position. Like it or not – you Hillary or die fanatics sunk your own boat.

The two candidates offer completely difference choices in a path to the future. The path will be decided in 2008.
Rather than having fun “flaming” Obama ...

Republicans must consider having to answer for the last eight years - that pain is real, current and unaddressed. Obama may or may not be the perfect choice, but show us the good the Republican way will bring - not the hate, economic oppression and arrogance we have had enough of already. We will not be bullied again! You have a great deal to account for.

Hillary Democrats – if you vote for the Republican agenda, you deserve the fool of the century award for cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Consider … who would have thought American could go so wrong in just eight years?
More of the same is suicide.

Yes “Change” is uncertain. However; the alternative is certain to deliver more of what got us dead, drained and broke even faster.

As we move into a direct comparison in the general election, I suspect the Dems only need to ask ... “Do want more of the same?”

It will be interesting to hear the Republican explanation that catastrophic mismanagement provides superior certainty based upon the fruits of their illustrious experience. Not a compelling argument for most of us....

[Bob]

Is Hillary still a viable long-shot? Perhaps, with about the same odds that a three-legged horse could win the Triple-Crown!

A house could fall on Obama! lol

Hillary's main impetus for staying in the race is the perverted pleasure she receives basking in the rays of notoriety.

She’ll get a clue eventually, throw in the towel, and scurry-on back to NY to catch-up on her “con-job” there!

http://klintons.com

[Tom in California]

Hillary Clinton quoting Karl Rove to support her candidacy! What a hoot! She's REALLY running on empty!

[mike tan]

as Asian/Indonesian imigrant I wil tell you obama supporters my suggestions. If I have a right to vote, I would not vote for obama and here is why. One, he spent his childhood in Indonesia, where I came from. He knew the Indonesian politic and corruption and he's demonstrating it now. He's a fake leader and corrupted, just like Indonesian ex- president. he manipulated and outsmarting the political system, that's why he has so many votes with the youngsters because young people did not read the news and did not know the fact and around the world and especially Indonesian make a joke and laugh if he's a president. Did you all people know that his name is a Muslim name. I have been spent my life in Indonesia and you know that raise me a flag. his corruption with tony ruzka, his bad pastor, he's already form a radical club. I could go on and on but I could not vote anyway. If I could I would vote for Clinton. she's the best person. I hope American people wake up.

[dave]

so they all commend each other on being political geniuses, duping, mocking and playing the gullible people.
obama, clinton, mccain...all players for the same new world order club. there's ample financial profit in it for each one of them, even those who get to play the minor roles in this staged drama that keeps getting more insane as longer this carries on - but this too is strategy: creating maximum confusion by ceaseless bombardment with absurdity, to get people to accept anything in the end, even if this might be the lowest common denominator, and to their detriment.
but more and more people see through this game, and get informed about the vital message of the media tabooed, prohibited and marginalized, but only valid candidate for PRESIDENT, RON PAUL.

[Marianne Menter]

The Election 2008 drama is fast becomong the stuff of afternoon television! Desperate Hillary is courting nasty Karl Rove? I am actually saddened. The Clinton's have had their day in the sun. and for their time in history, it was a good one. As centrists leading a nation mired in post-Reagan conservative orthodoxy, theirs was a clear view of elusive moderation. Bill Clinton salvaged a bankrupt economy while losing Congress to the Gingrich "Contract with America." After the Gi ngrich coronation, Bill Clinton spent most of his term fighting for his political life amid the slings and arrows of the de facto government imposed by Gingrich and his Congressional Republicans. The stolen election of 2000 brought still another Republican rise to power, along with Bush's endless war in Iraq, duly authorized by Hillary Clinnton. One of the marks of a truly great performer is knowing when to bow out. Hillary's increasingly shrill and delusional insistence that she has the self-defined "popular vote" flies in the face of her previous backroom scheming for the superdelegate count as she realized that by most people's math, she was no longer in command of the popular vote. It is time for Hillary to bow out. Her best remaining "win" is to step aside so the party can unite behind the candidate who must defeat McCain and his Republican attack machine in November. That candidate is Barak Obama. To see Clinton embrace Karl Rove is to realize that she will consort with anyone or anything in order to "win." Yes, it is time for change! Say good night to Hillary, and show politics as usual out the door.

[Patrick Reynolds]

Mr. Malcolm,
You say that Mr. Rove is "the Republican Svengali of modern American politics." I say that you're a clown and an unoriginal one at that. In the most recent national election, the GOP got trounced and Mr. Rove could not prevent it nor did he admit to seeing it coming.
Oh, but I see why you failed to mention this in your article. It's much more sensational the way you wrote it. You're pathetic!

[PJW5552]

What bunk! This Rovian analysis doesn't even warrant a comment. The fact Senator Clinton embraces it shows just how desperate she has become.

[stan]

Looking at Rove's own map, it's hard to picture even a single blue state going for McCain, but it's easy to see any number of 'red' states going for Obama---Wisconsin, SD, Montana, NH, NC, Nevada. It's also easy to picture Fla. and Missouri in play, and according to Rove's data, SC and Alaska are even within 5 percent. Once Obama gets the nomination officially, he'll get a significant bump in the polls all over the country, something McCain has already gotten months ago now. I would argue that this map is yet another reason for Dems to be optimistic about Obama's chances for a resounding victory in Nov.

[Aaron Burr V. Mexico]

We should start "The Hillary Project" so that all these fanatical frothing stupid people and feminazis that are threating to vote for McCain and that do, if McCain wins then we can all blame them when he screws up the country, individually, BY NAME.

And regardless of who wins, we need to put in place the infrastructure so that the stupid people do not win in 2012.

[Charlotte]

Karl Rove is a political genius. Too bad Hillary didn't find a Dem @ his level to run her campaign. Instead she went with someone who failed with Kerry & unfortunately failed her
as well.....

[Sandeep Shah]

Wake up you all Obama supporters otherwise you going to regret. This is politics and not a fairy land. Obama can't win against Mccain and you are going to loose an opportunity here. Obama is nothing more than a color presentation that you are so used to. But general elections is a different game. Hillary must win as this is not a trial and error method. It's a common sense that Obama is no way going to defeat Mccain even if he gets the 100% of black votes. It's a reality that you guys do not want to accept. You want to live in dreams but when you awake from sleep (Dec, 08), you gonna miss my comment. Obama may be a great candidate for future or as the vice president. The US needs experienced person otherwise US gonna a bankrupt :-(

[PulSamsara]

Clinton is a pathetic pandering human being.

[Eric]

I got new for all you online blogger types. You are the folks supporting obama. He like the latest internet craze. You think you are on the cutting edge by blindly supporting obama. As a matter of fact you're starting to sound like the old Bush supporters. My man can do no wrong. Not many of the Bush supporters left...get my point. By general election time, you'll see that the general population doesn't blog. And McCain will win in a landslide. Go out into the real world and see. I'm serious here. It's the online medai and online folks holding up this charade.

[Gaias Child]

When Sen. Clinton aligns with / appreciates Karl Rove she further demonstrates how long lost her moral compass is. There's no other value expressing than the ambition to win, to gouge the power out of history's inclination, to fight dirty and set a reverse example to the young. Does anybody know where the moral compass went?

[bethamarie]

I think that it is important to not only look at the colors of the map (which shows Rep vs. Dem), but also of the percentage points associated with each of the numbers. When looking at the McCain/Clinton map, the spread is much larger in favor of McCain in the Republican states than if it were McCain/Obama.

Take home message: Be very critical when reading maps and information!

[Anthony]

Karl Rove wants to add to a long drawn out Democratic nomination. Today it is impossible to know who will the presidency of America, other that it would not be Clinton. In order for Clinton to become the Democratic nominee there will have to be an absolute collapse of Obama's campaign.

The only reason that Hillary Clinton thinks Karl Rove is a political genius, is because he has shown that she can beat McCain where Obama can't.

The amount of respect that I had in Ms. Clinton has diminished for various reason. Clinton has cheapen what should have been a historic run for the first female presidential candidate. Yes, the media has been harsh on her, but she has made the situation worse. However, Clinton has greatly help Obama in the Democratic primaries.

I doubt that Obama will win. There are various reason that I will not discuss. He does represent change, but a more gradual change.

Clinton has successfully convinced her supports that she can still win. If she is able to secure 70% of the remaining pledge delegates, she would need 51% of the remaining super delegates. If Obama get 70% (which he will not), it is over for Clinton. In other words he will not need any more super delegates.

Karl Rove is not political genius. When the general election occurs the results from the both Democratic and GOP primaries (including polls) will be meaningless.

[al roberts]

Rove's conclusion is solely depend upon who is winning at this point. If Hillary was winning then he would put up a map saying Barack was stronger. It is all to make the losing side feel bad because the party is choosing the "weaker" candidate, the candidate they did not support. It is to keep the bad blood going within the Dem Party.

In this case, Rove just reaffirm their believe that Hillary is down because it was a scandal - the party and the media and the sexists are trying their best to put her down. They will believe even Rove because that's what they want to hear. It is not so much about the truth. It is all boils down to what you want to believe, especially in politic.

[ted chyn]

If you believe swiftboating, you would believe anything carl the devil trought at you.

[clay]

Maybe Rove is just as disgusted as everyone else is with how bad Bush and Cheney have damaged the Republican party and it's principles, as well as what the NeoCons have done to our country.

Perhaps Hillary Clinton is the best presidential material available and her clear priorities of America's economic and military strength, in addition to her inclusion of every individual citizen are universal. Perhaps her track-record of bi-partisan legislation makes her the most viable and acceptable candidate to everyone.

Maybe we don't need a NeoLib in Obama to further antagonize the huge split in our political ideologies. Barack Hussein is an extremely polarizing figure and can only hope to alienate a huge section of government and constituency. Some people in this country find him appaling because he is in no way qualified to run the country; and his vague promises (backed up by DC insiders (superdelegates)) can not be accomplished while isolated in an oval office while a siege rages outside the door.

Choose the candidate that will get the most done in the first 2 years, because a Barack Obama presidency will be the new poster child for the reactionary right-wing backlash to take back the House and Senate. Would a consensus opinion be better for these milestone changes, would it be better if we could all work together on these things that need to be done?

Anybody who knows anything about the tripartate system knows that you can not be effectively re-work the legislative branch from executive office. If it is so important to Obama to change the way Washington works (which is based off of the Constitution) maybe he should do that in the Senate where those things actually happen before running for president?

I trust Hillary Clinton because she says exactly what she will do for us and how she will do it and how to pay for it. I can't believe the government boys' club can dismiss her with a "sweetie-pie".

The gas tax holiday is an excellent strategy; there aren't any demographically average people saving only $10, there are truckers who burn thousands of gallons of diesel running independent businesses delivering your food, your gas, your toys. They literally drive the economy, and a few hundred dollars that they would save with a windfall profits tax on the oil industry might mean the difference between gasoline getting to the station, raw materials getting to your job, food getting to the grocery store. For every trucker that goes bankrupt, there are thousands of tons of goods that must still be delivered, putting a greater strain on the truckers' families and the delivery infrastructure. More overtime and maintenence on the supply-side means more pressure on YOUR wallet. It's about a lot more than your SUV only being $10 cheaper to run.

[Leo]

I hate people that say if its not hillary then I'm voting for Mecain. I first called them racist...second I called them idiots. Mecain 2yrs ago was looked @ as a demorcrat from his own parties standpoint...so why the sudden change...I say because his the manchurian candidate. Think about it a pow that is brain washed by the elite. Obama will be the best candidate that the U.S has seen in the past 20yrs and I'm happy that as a White Male American I have raisin above racism and excuses for not voting for Obama.

[W. Goin]

For those of you who say you will vote for McCain or an Independent candidate if Obama wins I ask you: are you prepared for 4,000+ more deaths in Iraq; are you prepared for an idiot who said "I don't know much about the economy;" are you prepared for a president who voted against the Fair Pay bill and said "women just need to get better education and more training;" are you prepared to have four more years of hell like the 7 we've just gone through? If not, take a deep breath, clear your head and make an intelligent decision - vote Obama. He will definitely make sure Hillary has a strong place in his administration and will do a great deal to bring this country back to the greatness we experienced before Bush. And, he will reach out to other countries and help the United States regain the respect we had before Junior.

[Paul W.]

Looking at Rove's map, I think it would be helpful to expand the 'toss up' states to those with +/- 4%, it gives Obama a far more competitive map which (looking at how much more money Obama has than McCain or Hillary) that is also feasible for him to overcome relatively slim margins held by McCain.

[CARLOS IMMANUEL LLANES SR]

Must read for all.

Barak Obama - 50 Lies and Counting: Posted on Political forum.com - Elections and Campaigns.

1.) Selma Got Me Born - LIAR, your parents felt safe enough to have you in 1961 - Selma had no effect on your birth, as Selma was in 1965.

2.) Father Was A Goat Herder - LIAR, he was a privileged, well educated youth, who went on to work with the Kenyan Government.

3.) Father Was A Proud Freedom Fighter - LIAR, he was part of one of the most corrupt and violent governments Kenya has ever had.

4.) My Family Has Strong Ties To African Freedom - LIAR, your cousin Raila Odinga has created mass violence in attempting to overturn a legitimate election in 2007, in Kenya. It is the first widespread viole nce in decades.

5.) My Grandmother Has Always Been A Christian - LIAR, she does her daily Salat prayers at 5am according to her own interviews. Not to mention, Christianity wouldn't allow her to have been one of 14 wives to 1 man.

6.) My Name is African Swahili - LIAR, your name is Arabic and Baraka (from which Barack came) means blessed in that language. Hussein is also Arabic and so is Obama.

7.) I Never Practiced Islam - LIAR, you practiced it daily at school, where you were registered as a Muslim and kept that faith for 31 years, until your wife made you change, so you could run for office.

8.) My School In Indonesia Was Christian - LIAR, you were registered as Muslim there and got in trouble in Koranic Studies for making faces (check your own book).

9.) I Was Fluent In Indonesian - LIAR, not one teacher says you could speak the language.

10.) Because I Lived In Indonesia, I Have More Foreign Experience - LIAR, you were there from the ages of 6 to 10, and couldn't even speak the language. What did you learn, how to study the Koran and watch cartoons.

11.) I Am Stronger On Foreign Affairs - LIAR, except for Africa (surprise) and the Middle East (bigger surprise), you have never been anywhere else on the planet and thus have NO experience with our closest allies.

12.) I Blame My Early Drug Use On Ethnic Confusion - LIAR, you were quite content in high school to be Barry Obama, no mention of Kenya and no mention of struggle to identify - your classmates said you were just fine.

13.) An Ebony Article Moved Me To Run For Office - LIAR, Ebony has yet to find the article you mention in your book. It doesn't, and never did, exist.

14.) A Life Magazine Article Changed My Outlook On Life - LIAR, Life has yet to find the article you mention in your book. It doesn't, and never did, exist.

15.) I Won't Run On A National Ticket In '08 - LIAR, here you are, despite saying, live on TV, that you would not have enough experience by then, and you are all about having experience first.

16.) Present Votes Are Common In Illinois - LIAR, they are common for YOU, but not many others have 130 NO VOTES.

17.) Oops, I Misvoted - LIAR, only when caught by church groups and democrats, did you beg to change your 'misvote'.

18.) I Was A Professor Of Law - LIAR, you were a senior lecturer ON LEAVE.

19.) I Was A Constitutional Lawyer - LIAR, you were a senior lecturer ON LEAVE.

20.) Without Me, There Would Be No Ethics Bill - LIAR, you didn't write it, introduce it, change it, or create it.

21.) The Ethics Bill Was Hard To Pass - LIAR, it took just 14 days from start to finish.

22.) I Wrote A Tough Nuclear Bill - LIAR, your bill was rejected by your own party for its pandering and lack of all regulation - mainly because of your Nuclear Donor, Exelon, from which David Axelrod came.

23.) I Have Released My State Records - LIAR, as of March, 2008, state bills you sponsored or voted for have yet to be released, exposing all the special interests pork hidden within.

24.) I Took On The Asbestos Altgeld Gardens Mess - LIAR, you were part of a large group of people who remedied Altgeld Gardens. You failed to mention anyone else but yourself, in your books.

25.) My Economics Bill Will Help America - LIAR, your 111 economic policies were just combined into a proposal which lost 99-0, and even YOU voted against your own bill.

26.) I Have Been A Bold Leader In Illinois - LIAR, even your own supporters claim to have not seen BOLD action on your part.

27.) I Passed 26 Of My Own Bills In One Year - LIAR, they were not YOUR bills, but rather handed to you, after their creation by a fellow Senator, to assist you in a future bid for higher office.

28.) No One Contacted Canada About NAFTA - LIAR, the Candian Government issued the names and a memo of the conversation your campaign had with them.

29.) I Am Tough On Terrorism - LIAR, you missed the Iran Resolution vote on terrorism and your good friend Ali Abunimah supports the destruction of Israel.

30.) I Am Not Acting As President Yet - LIAR, after the NAFTA Memo, a dead terrorist in the FARC, in Colombia, was found with a letter stating how you and he were working together on getting FARC recognized officially.

31.) I Didn't Run Ads In Florida - LIAR, you allowed national ads to run 8 -12 times per day for two weeks - and you still lost.

32.) I Won Michigan - LIAR, no you didn't.

33.) I won Nevada - LIAR, no you did not.

34.) I Want All Votes To Count - LIAR, you said let the delegates decide.

35.) I Want Americans To Decide - LIAR, you prefer caucuses that limit the vote, confuse the voters, force a public vote, and only operate during small windows of time.

36.) I passed 900 Bills in the State Senate - LIAR, you passed 26, most of which you didn't write yourself.

37.) My Campaign Was Extorted By A Friend - LIAR, that friend is threatening to sue if you do not stop saying this. Obama has stopped saying this.

38.) I Believe In Fairness, Not Tactics - LIAR, you used tactics to eliminate Alice Palmer from running against you.

39.) I Don't Take PAC Money - LIAR, you take loads of it.

40.) I don't Have Lobbysists - LIAR, you have over 47 lobbyists, and counting.

41.) My Campaign Had Nothing To Do With The 1984 Ad - LIAR, your own campaign worker made the ad on his Apple in one afternoon.

42.) My Campaign Never Took Over MySpace - LIAR, Tom, who started MySpace issued a warning about this advertising to MySpace clients.

43.) I Inspire People With My Words - LIAR, you inspire people with other people's words.

44.) I Have Passed Bills In The U.S. Senate - LIAR, you have passed A BILL in the U.S. Senate - for Africa, which shows YOUR priorities.

45.) I Have Always Been Against Iraq - LIAR, you weren't in office to vote against it AND you have voted to fund it every single time, unlike Kucinich, who seems to be out gutting you Obama. You also seem to be stepping back from your departure date - AGAIN.

46.) I Have Always Supported Universal Health Care - LIAR, your plan leaves us all to pay the 15,000,000 who don't have to buy it.

47.) I Only Found Out About My Investment Conflicts Via Mail - LIAR, both companies you site as having sent you letters about this conflict have no record of any such letter ever being created or sent.

48.) I Am As Patriotic As Anyone - LIAR, you won't wear a flag pin and you don't put your hand over your heart during the Anthem.

49.) My Wife Didn't Mean What She Said About Pride In Country - LIAR, your wife's words follow lock-step in the vain of Wright and Farrahkan, in relation to their contempt and hatred of America.

50.) Wal-Mart Is A Company I Wouldn't Support - LIAR, your wife has received nearly a quarter of a million dollars through Treehouse, which is connected to Wal-Mart.

PASS IT ON PLEASE...and counting: Posted on Political forum.com - Elections and Campaigns. Share with A friend.
SHALO'M 5769

[Jacky]

Clearly, "Must Read", you need a life .... you probably don't know that much about your own boring, pathetic life.