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A Florida revote might not be a slam dunk for Hillary Clinton

As the Democratic imbroglio continues over what to do about the out-of-bounds Michigan and Florida primaries, a recent poll offers a reminder of how tantalizing a true, fully engaged face-off between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama in those two states would be.

The survey, sponsored in part by the St. Petersburg Times, asked Floridians a number of questions -- some strictly local -- on Saturday, Sunday and Monday. But the one that caught our interest focused on the two Democratic presidential candidates. It found Clinton ahead, with 46%, but Obama within shouting distance, at 37%.

Even more intriguing, 16% said they were undecided -- meaning an aggressive, persuasive campaign could make all the difference in determining a victor.

Also, the figures represent slippage for Clinton since she won Florida's Jan. 29 primary -- the one the Democratic National Committee ruled wouldn't count and the one that, as a result, proceeded without the candidates actually pitching for support. In that contest, Clinton received 50% of the vote, compared with 33% for Obama and 14% for John Edwards (still an active candidate at the time).

Michigan's unsanctioned primary, held two weeks before Florida's, was even more problematic. As most no doubt recall, Obama and Edwards -- to show their solidarity with the DNC -- asked that their names be removed from the ballot. Clinton kept hers on, and we remember being struck at the time that the 55% she won in the vote didn't seem particularly impressive under the circumstances ("uncommitted" voters tallied 40%).

All the more reason to think that, as in Florida, a real Clinton/Obama race in Michigan would be worth the price of admission (or, more to the point, whatever it costs to make it happen).

For the latest on the impasse surrounding the two state, see here.

-- Don Frederick

 
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If that's the case and the Obama people are constantly saying that if Obama had been allowed to campaign (he was the only candidate to have ads up on cable however) he would have wowed the voters there with his soaring rhetoric -why are they not shouting from the highest rafters that they want a revote? Just words-

HILARY, ACCORDING TO YOU "EVERY AMERICAN HAS A RIGHT TO BE A PART OF OUR GREAT DEMOCRACY, EVERY VOICE SHOULD HAVE THE CHANCE TO BE HEARD AND EVERY VOTE COUNTED. "

OBVOUSLY YOU DIDN'T THINK, "EVERY VOICE SHOULD HAVE THE CHANCE TO BE HEARD" WHEN YOU VOTED NOT TO SEAT MICHIGAN AND FLORIDA BUT NOW THAT YOU ARE LOSING, EVERY VOICE MUST BE HEARD AND SENATOR OBAMA IS STANDING IN THE WAY OF THAT. INSTEAD OF ALL YOUR CRYING AND WIMPERING WHY NOT AGREE THAT IF SENATOR OBAMA AGREES TO A MICHIGAN AND FLORIDA RE-VOTE YOU WILL AGREE TO ABIDE BY THE POPULAR VOTE AND THE HELL WITH THE SUPER DELEGATES. THIS WILL SHOW THAT YOU ARE REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT "EVERY VOICE HAVING, THE CHANCE TO BE HEARD AND EVERY VOTE COUNTED".

THE TRUTH IS THAT YOU WILL NOT AGREE TO THIS BECAUSE YOU KNOW THAT YOU WILL LOSE. YOU DON'T REALLY CARE ABOUT PEOPLES VOTES. ALL YOU CARE ABOUT IS WINNING THE WHITE HOUSE.

SAUL ANUZIS HAD IT RIGHT WHEN HE SAID __SHE THUMBED HER NOSE AT THE ENTIRE STATE BY REFUSING TO CAMPAIGN HERE, NOW THAT SHE IS LOCKED IN A TIGHT NOMINATION BATTLE AND NEEDS MICHIGAN VOTERS, I SUGGEST THEY EXTEND HER THE SAME COURTESY SHE SHOWED THEM.

YOU, LIKE YOUR LOUDMOUTH HUSBAND GO FROM STATE-TO-STATE SAYING ANYTHING AND DOING ANYTHING YOU CAN TO CONVINCE PEOPLE THAT YOU ARE THE BEST CHOICE FOR THIS COUNTRY. DO YOU REALLY BELIEVE THAT WE ARE SO STUPID?

YOUR GOING DOWN BIG TIME BABE, DON'T LET THE DOOR HIT YOU ON THE ASS ON THE WAY OUT.

You LA Times clowns never stop shilling for Hillary, do you? This is another in a long list of recent articles that could have been written by Hillary's campaign staff.

Why don't you report the truth: Team Hillary and its allies in Michigan are trying to set up a phony, rigged vote that would exclude tens of thousands of likely Obama voters.

That Senator Obama believes he can be elected President of the United States after associating himself with the racsist, anti-American Reverend Wright says more about his lack of judgment than the fact that he asscociated with Reverend Wright in the first place.

You have not provided readers a link; you haven't indicated if it was a scientific result.

Please include links when quoting from a source.

First of all, let me introduce myself as a working class Democrat, a species hardly known by you writers, yet you write extensively about us.

Let me be kind to you as a reward for giving me an opportunity to post here and give you an insight into my mind as regards the Obama race flap. Let me also identify myself as a Black woman living in Jamaica Queens. If the New York Times wants verifcation of that, they are welcomed to do so. My comments are as follows:

I am glad that the Liberal Elitists are beginning to see, in spite of their cool-aid-drinking, loud praise for their Messiah Obama's speech, we the working class Democrats out here saw it and didn't see a few things in Obama's speech, and they are as follows:

We saw:

1). That he preferred to throw his kind grandmother under the bus instead of distancing from this man's hate and venom. He has now totally destroyed her legacy, and for someone who has sacrificed so much for him, it is sad, it is a shame! We wished he loved his granny more than he loved pastor.

2).That he still refused to outright comdemn the source of this hate and venom for country.

3). That he lied on Friday on TV when he did the rounds and at each stage stated that he was never in church when Wright preached in this way when in fact he was.

4). That his so-called "great speech" was a mere attempt to divert the issue to race instead of to his pastor's anti-American rants and rave.

Note: We working class Democrats could forgive his pastor's vile and rabid racism, if that is what he wanted us to do, but we can never, and I mean never, forgive his pastor for damning, America, slandering our country's name and accusing this country of vile, despicable deeds comparable with deeds Hitler would commit.

5). We saw Obama's judgement as he gave that speech. Farrakhan, Wright, Amadinejad, Chavez, what's his name in Korea. If he could tolerate and feel comfortable with Wright and Farrakhan, it spoke directly to his judgement on our foreign policy. If this was the test, he failed it miserably and it is not something we should ignore. The consequeces of not getting it right is too damning!

[B]What I didn't see was[/B]:

1). The reason Obama exposed himself, his wife and his two girls to this hate for 20 years?

2). The truth about Black churches. He implied that this is what goes on in Black churches. Well he lied about that as well. He threw them under the bus as well.

3). His taking full responsibility and full explaination.

4). And reasons to trust this man with the key to America.

In conclusion, let me say to all the Liberal Elitists out there, if you expect this man to be our standard bearer and proudly carry our flag, then you'd better come up with a reason why he hung out with the likes of Wright who in turn hangs out with Farrakhan, because Secretary of State Farrakhan scares me far less now, than presidential advisor Jeremiah Wright.

You see, we the working class is too busy earning a living than to nuance or to even put up with you "smarty pants" while you do it, but make no mistake about it, we are oftentimes much smarter than you guys, and WE GET IT!

PS: Thank you New York Times, for giving me this opportunity to vent. I really do appreciate! And if I may offer myself to occasionally give your readers a view from the grassroots, I would welcome the job because believe it or not, right now I am unemployed and job-hunting, and as you can see, I could string a few words together while being totally authenic. I told you, I was the real thing!

You know what?

If the Democratics don't want Forida & Michigan votes, that's fine.

Come election time, we'll just give them to the Republicans.

;-)

The level of toxic mud slinging of Obama v. Clinton supporters has reached epic proportions. You all should be proud of yourselves. You're handing over, what could've been an easy Dem victory in November, to the Republicans. Speaking as a Conservative, I say, 'thank you."

Michigan and Florida brought this foolishness on themselves.

Florida is controlled by Republican legislators that wanted to move up and vote earlier.

Florida Democrats were warned they couldn't have a primary that early!

Michigan got opinionated they should go earlier ahead of other states, they were denied.

Private donors can't pay for a public election. Both states don't have the money to re-vote.

The people do matter, votes are supposed to count. The process is jacked up. Democratic parties in Michigan and Florida should be held accountable.

Someone said split the delegates from each state evenly and move on.

Clinton's campaign could never claim the flawed delegates process that occurred in each state. Rules were broken, candidates didn't campaign in those states.

Michigan politicians went on Spring Break, it's over. Florida gave up already.

Split the delegates, they both benefit.


My opinion on the Rev. Wright statements, he wasn't spouting unpatriotic things every Sunday. Videos go back to 2005?

20 years Obama has appreciated the Church building, where he got married and children were baptized.

The Church has a 300 member choir. It has programs that help citizens in that community. 8,000 members, its a huge crowd to be part of. Majority of the church programs are spiritual.

I attended Catholic schools and gone to Church for decades, I rarely pay attention to the sermons. We know some Priests and Pastors had secrets. How the Church moved " predator" Priests or Nuns around but didn't stop their behaviour.

The question there, why didn't Catholics abandon the Church's where molestation by Priests or Nuns occurred?

People hold on to the Church buildings where they have a history.

I'm not going look down upon Obama's Church, some of Rev. Wrights statements were wrong. Forgivably wrong.

A lot of people become anti patriotic some times in their life. Some people are hording guns and feeling threatened by the Federal Government. Wanting to shoot Federals seems unpatriotic to me.

Money laundering, cheating on taxes is unpatriotic.

Rev. Wright hasn't caused any social destruction. He can gain new perspectives and try to do better from now on.

Obama didn't take his two daughters into a pit of hatred at all, that's ludicrous.

He has had the opposite reaction to the rage inside Rev. Wright.


The voters of Florida and Michigan have been punished long enough for the "perceived sins" of their respective governments and pigheaded party leaders of the DNC have already done enough damage. It's time to stop acting like a Banana Republic and COUNT THE VOTES that the voters gave during those LEGAL state run primaries that were held.

If the votes are counted now, that would not give those states the early advantage that they wanted.

A re-vote is too costly at double digit millions it appears. And why do it? Because Obama was too stupid to not leave his name on the ballot in just one of those states? He and/or his surrogates still campaigned there by running ads telling voters to vote "undecided" and guess what? Hillary still beat him.

Obama and Clinton were at the same disadvantage in both states, where both did as DNC leaders requested and didn't break the rules by not campaigning. But the DNC did not demand that they take their names off the ballots and did not say that in the event of a close race where there are not enough delegates for EITHER candidate to win, that those states couldn't have their primaries counted at a later date and have those delegates seated proportional to the actual votes that were counted!

COUNT the votes! This is a democracy! The only thing that should matter is the will of the voters. And if people were too lazy to get out and vote in either of those elections or if someone took their name off the ballot without being asked to do so... then TOUGH LUCK! Voters could have voted in both of those elections for OTHER things that were on the ballot. So there is no accepting an excuse like "oh we didn't think it would count". Some people just CHOOSE not to vote in all elections. That's a fact.

So count the votes as the votes were given or democrats will LOSE two major purple states and the GOP will be saying: Thank you! Gracias! Good Luck and Goodbye!

WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS COUNTRY... VOTERS OF FLORIDA WANT THEIR VOTES COUNTED OR WE WILL GO REPUBLICAN!! This is absurd.

There is a big grassroots movement happening in Florida and Michigan to have the people fund a revote at http://floridamichiganrevote.com/ it is a new sit getting a lot of buzz.


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About the Columnist
A veteran foreign and national correspondent, Andrew Malcolm has served on the L.A. Times Editorial Board and was a Pulitzer finalist in 2004. He is the author of 10 nonfiction books and father of four. Read more.
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