Clinton, Obama go for the jugulars (each other's)

What a difference a week (or, more precisely, just six days) can make.

When the Democratic presidential candidates gathered last Tuesday in Las Vegas for a debate after several days of racially tinged bickering between Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama and their surrogates, the two candidates decided to take a step back and cool the tensions.

Tonight in South Carolina, with potentially make-or-break contests in the party's presidential race looming, the gloves came off quickly, with Clinton and Obama engaging in their most heated one-on-one exchanges to date.

Obama came out swinging first, using a fairly routine question -- about Clinton's charges that he hasn't spelled out how he would pay for programs he has proposed -- as a springboard to vent over what he considers a range of unfair criticism directed at him of late by her and her husband, Bill Clinton.

Hillary Clinton would have none of it, and she took after Obama on a variety of topics. Obama, in turn, attacked her and before the back-and-forth was over, each had turned over rocks they had avoided before.

Obama took a shot at Clinton for working as "a corporate lawyer sitting on the board of Wal-Mart" while he was ...

a community organizer in Chicago.

Clinton responded sharply, elaborating on her criticism that Obama recently had praised Republicans for having been willing during the 1990s to put forth innovative ideas -- a claim Obama insists is a gross distortion of the point he was making. Clinton than added this zinger: "I was fighting against those ideas when you were practicing law and representing your contributor, [Tony] Rezko, in his slum landlord business in inner-city Chicago."

(The Chicago Sun-Times wrote last spring about Obama's embarrassing link to Rezko.)

All this dirty laundry was aired before the debate had passed the 30-minute mark.

Later, as she dissected Obama's legislation record, she seemed almost like a teacher scolding a wayward student when she said: "It is very difficult to have a staright-up debate with you because you never take responsibility for your votes."

The third candidate on the stage, John Edwards (increasingly an afterthought in the contest), sought to provide some perspective, saying, "This kind of squabbling, how many children is this going to get healthcare?"

Many Democratic leaders might have been left wondering how many independent voters this kind of squabbling -- the mention of Wal-Mart, the reference to Rezko -- might drive away from the eventual nominee later this year.

-- Don Frederick

Comments

[David Hopcroft]

If Obama found the going tough in the South Carolina debate then is he really ready for the likes of Romney or McCain ?
Whatever his connections were with a Chicago slum landlord who is now facing corruption charges, you have to ask yourself a question about his judgement.
I fear that if he became the nomination we could see a multitude of stories emerging that would dominate the advertisements of the Republicans.
He just seems so vulnerable. His 'maybe or maybe not' record was rightly questioned by John Edwards. The US needs a strong leader who can be decisive.
The Clintons have seen mud being slung at them for so many years that Hilary Clinton has enough at her fingertips to hit back hard. Believe me, there are two Republican candidates who can hit just as hard as Hilary.
Good to hear John Edwards sticking to his principles. He may not always get the votes, but there are so many who respect his conduct and behavior. He can sometimes stand out as the statesman and diplomat.

[justin edward]

Excerpt from Village Voice article below:

They would have dropped their forks if they had heard that Hillary served for six years on the board of the dreaded Wal-Mart, a union-busting behemoth. If they had learned the details of her friendship with Wal-Mart, they might have lost their lunches.

She didn't mention Wal-Mart. Instead, she praised the Teamsters and other unionized workers as a "key movement in creating the middle class," and she pledged to "prevent anyone from turning the clock back," reminding them that "the Republicans are trying to do away with collective bargaining."

As she was leaving the dais, she ignored a reporter's question about Wal-Mart, and she ignored it again when she strode by reporters in the hotel lobby.

But there are questions. In 1986, when Hillary was first lady of Arkansas, she was put on the board of Wal-Mart. Officials at the time said she wasn't filling a vacancy. In May 1992, as Hubby's presidential campaign heated up, she resigned from the board of Wal-Mart. Company officials said at the time that they weren't going to fill her vacancy.

So what the hell was she doing on the Wal-Mart board? According to press accounts at the time, she was a show horse at the company's annual meetings when founder Sam Walton bused in cheering throngs to celebrate his non-union empire, which is headquartered in Arkansas, one of the country's poorest states. According to published reports, she was placed in charge of the company's "green" program to protect the environment.

But nobody got greener than Sam Walton and his family. For several years in the '80s, he was judged the richest man in America by Forbes magazine; his fortune zoomed into the billions until he split it up among relatives. It's no surprise that Hillary is a strong supporter of free trade with China. Wal-Mart, despite its "Buy American" advertising campaign, is the single largest U.S. importer, and half of its imports come from China.

Was Hillary the voice of conscience on the board for American and foreign workers? Contemporary accounts make no mention of that. They do describe her as a "corporate litigator" in those days, and they mention, speaking of environmental matters, that she also served on the board of Lafarge, a company that, according to a press account, once burned hazardous fuels to run its cement plants.

Wal-Mart, though, was the crown jewel of Arkansas, the state's First Company fit for a first lady. During her tenure on the board, she presumably helped preside over the most remarkable growth of any company until Bill Gates came along. The number of Wal-Mart employees grew during the '80s from 21,600 to 279,000, while sales soared from $1.2 billion to $25.8 billion.

And the Clintons depended on Wal-Mart's largesse not only for Hillary's regular payments as a board member but for travel expenses on Wal-Mart planes and for heavy campaign contributions to Bill's campaigns there and nationally. According to reports in the early '90s, before Bill and Hillary moved to D.C., neither was raking in the big bucks, but prominent in their income were her holdings of between $50,000 and $100,000 worth of Wal-Mart stock.

A press report on the Clintons' finances during the early stages of Bill's 1992 run for the presidency showed that most of their income came from her $109,719 annual salary from the Rose Law Firm and tens of thousands of dollars in fees she received from serving on corporate boards. (She was on two others besides Wal-Mart's.) Her honoraria and director fees grew almost as fast as Wal-Mart's profits during the '80s—rising from $111 in 1980 to $6500 in 1986 to $64,700 in 1991, according to the same source.

During the same period, small towns all over America began complaining that Wal-Mart was squeezing out ma-and-pa stores and leaving little burgs throughout the Midwest and South with downtowns that featured little more than empty storefronts.

But selected small companies were doing quite well, thanks to the Clintons' friendship with Wal-Mart. The Boston Globe reported in January 1992 that Bill Clinton had introduced a brush company's executives to Wal-Mart executives, hoping that the two could do bidness. Executives of the brush company had been rebuffed in previous attempts to sell their products to Wal-Mart. Lucky for the company, it happened to be located in New Hampshire, where Clinton was trying to win a presidential primary. At the time, Hillary Clinton was still on Wal-Mart's board, and the retail giant was still resisting the unionization of any of its workers.

Last week, Hillary was wearing a different hat. She stood in solidarity with the elderly Teamsters as Local 237 president Carl Haynes greeted her warmly, endorsed her, and then left early on what other union officials described as "AFL-CIO business."

But the AFL-CIO was thinking of other business only a few months earlier when the union's leaders, including its chief, John Sweeney, marched specifically against Wal-Mart's oppression of its meat-market workers. According to a Web site run by activists at the AFL-CIO affiliate United Food and Commercial Workers, Wal-Mart "has profited by pushing its workers to the bottom of the wage scale." The union points out that hourly wages "average $2 to $3 per hour less than at unionized supermarkets." More grave for workers everywhere in the United States are these figures spouted by union activists: Wal-Mart is the largest private employer in the country, "yet fewer than 40 percent of its workers are covered by the company's health plan."

The union notes that Wal-Mart's "hometown" judge in Arkansas issued a nationwide temporary restraining order against the UFCW, barring anyone associated with the union from entering Wal-Mart facilities to educate workers about their legal rights in the workplace. The union, however, successfully appealed the order—noting that the judge holds more than $500,000 in Wal-Mart stock. The case remains in litigation.

Meanwhile, Wal-Mart's first lady, who also benefited from Wal-Mart stock, solicits support from union workers.

Which makes her words to the elderly Teamsters last week especially poignant: "You can count on me to stand up for the right to collectively bargain!"

[hms]

Do they realize how terribly unattractive it makes themselves look? Both of them are barely acceptable as it is.

[James T.]

I just wanted to say that I thought that the performance of all three candidates was great, but it was clear that Edwards won. And it's not because I'm a supporter. Everyone who's posting of course wants to support their candidate, but I think we can objectively say that he was the best debater. Why?
(1) He rose above the fray and squelched the personal attacks that were going on between OHB and HRC early on, getting the debate back on tract.
(2) A lot of his policy points are first articulated by him and then simply repeated by the other candidates. For example, green-collared jobs -- he came up with that before HRC. The need for universal health care -- he came up with a plan months before HRC came up with a not-so-comprehensive one, that repeats many ideas of JRE.
(3) He was clear and straight to the point. On the health care issue, he was able to challenge OHB's rationale for not supporting universal health care. (read the transcript).

[Phil]

It figures what do you expect from Career politicians!

[glenn crawford]

My daughter(Mercer Univ. student) my wife and I attempted to attend a rally for Hillary Clinton(Bill was speaking) at Mercer University in Macon, Ga. earlier today. We waited two hours in the bitter cold until we were turned away at the door. Then we had no idea if we were to be let in or not. At least 1000 people were turned away after waiting for 2 hours!. The Clinton campaign totally mismanaged the entire affair and left scores of people furious at the lack of concern shown to the public that took a day off from work to see President Clinton speak. It turns out the Clinton campaign knew all along how many could be fit in the arena but did not count out to that number in the line and have the consideration to tell the others to forget getting in. The cops came out and threatened to taser the peaceful crowd of elderly and students if they did not clear the building in 5 minutes. The Mercer students were not given any kind of preferential treatment for entry even though it was on their campus. The crowd began chanting Obama! Obama! as they were removed from the building. Shoddy treatment by the Clintons

[Y]

Yes, elections are about the future...
and the Clintons have a lot more to do with the past.
Maybe WalMart would take Hillary back.
http://unitedagainsthillary.wordpress.com

[patrick]

A woman and a man as oppressed people of "color," tell jokes about the "white guy"...my my the world has changed...

In the Black World of language, OBAMA could have said "BITCH" but political correctness carries the day, and the woman issue trumps OBAMA frankness.

Obama never should have said to Hillary: "I agree"...when talking about Hillary's Republican critique. He should have stayed on the highest moral ground where we expect him to stay.

If you roll in the dirt you get dirty.

[goldenstate]

Mrs. Obama was on the board of Treehouse Foods, who is a big supplier to Wal-Mart. So Clinton and Obama both have ties to Wal-Mart.

[George P.]

Senator Edwards looked strong tonight, and all three of them were very good and impressive, much more coherent, smart, and willing to tackle difficult problems facing America head-on than any of the Republican candidates.

Mr. Edwards’ chance for becoming the Democratic nominee is remote, but he will stay in the race fighting hard till the Super Tuesday state primaries are over. His strategy, I suspect, is to gain enough delegates so that if the convention delegate counts between Mrs. Clinton and Mr. Obama are very close then he will become a kingmaker, which should also assure him of the vice-presidential spot. Both Mrs. Clinton and Mr. Obama need a white Southern male running mate.

In other words, Mr. Edwards has the strategy of “if you can’t beat them, join them.” Since there is a good chance that any Democratic ticket will win this fall’s presidential election, provided that Clinton or Obama administration does well, he will then, at the end of either administration, be the shoe-in presidential candidate.

It’s a wise strategy knowing that he is only 54. In eight years, he will be 62, still an excellent age to run for president.

[Jenna]

To be fair, under Sam Walton Wal-Mart bought American and did not take full advantage of the cheap labor to be had in the global markets while he was in charge. I believe when Hillary was on the board, Sam Walton was still in charge. However, after he stepped down, that’s when Wal-Mart became the scary behemoth it is now. Although Wal-Mart was probably never union friendly, it was not the monster it is now when she was on the board.

[NoMoreBlatherDotCom]

Glenn Crawford might be a real person telling a true story.

But, something about his tale reminds me of this:

tbtf.com/resource/gojava.html

[Ronald Loui]

Well, the same sort of story (not with tasers and Obama chants, but with late arrival, no consideration for the audience, and people starting to throw things) was run all over the St. Louis press when the Clintons were supposed to fly from Nevada to Missouri but were delayed because they were watching the caucus returns. It seems candidates are often late, so I am not sure why people get so upset, and security is always muscle-headed. However, Hillary does list Chief-Operating-Officer skills among her strengths. Presumably, someone will be held accountable.

It was indeed a debate worth watching, though the bigger news here in the midsection, today, is that ex-Senator Jean Carnahan has joined Senator Claire McCaskill, endorsing Obama. If you add Senator Tom Eagleton's wife, who is a big Obama supporter, these have to be the holy trinity among powerful women in Missouri. Jean C, you will remember, is the woman who occupied a Senate seat after "John Ashcroft lost to a dead man," her late husband, Governor Mel C, who tragically was lost in a plane crash during his Senate campaign. Any woman who votes for Hillary in Missouri must confront the evidence of extremely strong and respected women's opposing points of view.

[DanC]

To be fair, HRC didn't divest herself of large holdings in Wal-Mart until last year, when the campaign heated up and it would be dicey to be sitting on a five-figure position. And, for a woman who says her 35 years of experience have all been about children, there is no record that she used the bully pulpit at the Wal-Mart board to advocate against the company's repeated violations of child labor laws in THIS country-- not to mention their heavy business with child exploiters abroad or dealings with companies that cut corners by, say, manufacturing toys with lead-based paint.

Surely some of these abuses were out there in 1991, when she was on the board, and most were out there in 1997, when she and her husband were sitting on a big chuck of Wal-Mart stock.

Seriously, I wont even shop in that miserable store--why does it take Hillary so long to pull up her portfolio online, find Wal-Mart in the holdings, and click "sell."

Everying for children? Please!