Ask Alana: Screaming children on planes and vegetarian Thanksgivings

This week: screaming babies on planes and polite vegetarians among people who just love the taste of bird. If you have a question for our etiquette maven, write to askalana@latimes.com.

Alana,

What do you do if you're sitting on a long plane ride next to a squalling child? On the one hand, there's only so much a parent can do. On the other hand, a transcontinental or trans-oceanic flight lasts a looooong time.

-- Elaine Chao, San Francisco

Elaine,

It is a sad truth that screaming babies on airplanes are as much a part of life as death, taxes and that weird matter that collects on the top of your ice cream if you leave it in the freezer for too long. Even more tragic: It is usually the case that the closer you are sitting to a screaming baby, the more likely you are to have forgotten your earplugs, headphones, iPod or heavy drugs that would help you sleep through the din of a million babies singing show tunes.

Of course the best thing to do is to remember your anti-screaming-baby implements, such as earplugs and headphones. But some babies pierce even those top-notch headphones advertised in your in-flight magazine. Parents –- if you’re bringing a baby on an airplane, be sure to remember bottles and pacifiers for the baby to suck on, as the sucking will reduce the pressure on the baby’s ears. Some people recommend it, but many are opposed to giving your baby Benadryl to knock him out.

If the baby's screams are still driving you bonkers ...

... it’s best to quietly complain to the flight attendant rather than loudly to the parents, said Courtney Caldwell, editor-in-chief of Road & Travel Magazine. Telling a parent to shut his kid up “can get ugly,” Caldwell said, even if you’re just asking the parent to take a walk with the child so you have a moment of peace. And on airplanes, everyone can hear you scream (unless they’ve drugged themselves well). Better to let a trained professional deal with the child. 

It wouldn't be too rude for experienced parents who have tips for dealing with screaming babies to give some advice to the parents of little monsters, Caldwell said, but only if you have a really helpful suggestion. You could breach the topic by saying “My child used to scream too, and I did X and Y.” That way you seem empathetic rather than just mean or pushy. However, this is not the time to bring up that your child used to scream on airplanes and you found out it was because he was gravely ill or had been bitten by a vampire and was doomed.

If you haven’t had children, it’s best not to try to help the parents, as you probably have no idea what they’re going through. Offering to hold the baby will make them think you're weird and offering candy or toys will make you look like a predator. Just sit back, try to relax, and hey, maybe take some of that if Benadryl yourself.

-- Alana

Dear Alana,

I became a vegetarian three years ago. This holiday season, I have been invited to spend a holiday dinner with a friend and her family. While I would very much like to participate in the festivities, I am concerned that my dietary restrictions will be a problem. I don't want to inconvenience my hosts by requiring them to cook a special meal for me, but I also dread the thought of loading my plate with salad at the dinner table whilst having to answer why I'm not partaking in the rest of the bounty (in my experience, people take offense when one does not eat what is offered). Can I accept the invitation without offending?

-- Jenny Carleton, Montclair, N.J.

Jenny,

So the thought of eating meat makes you want to jump into the burning fires of Mordor? Poor you. It must not be fun to be a vegetarian in a season where many holidays revolve around eating assorted birds. I hope your friend's family isn’t Maori, because their holiday meal includes burying meats in hot stones and then digging them up a little later to chow down.

You can accept the invitation without offending, as long as you’re not going to use the meal as a platform to talk about the evils of meat and how eating a turkey is as immoral as eating a baby. After all, the Indians probably came to the Pilgrims’ dinner and saw the lobster that was allegedly served for the first Thanksgiving and thought "Eeeww, don’t they know it’s a bottom feeder?" But they still sat down at the table and ate together and probably didn’t even make cracks about the buckles on the Pilgrims’ hats.

However. There are two schools of thought as to how you should approach the meal. Advice columnist Amy Alcon says "it’s unpolite to have all these special dietary needs." She recommends bringing a vegan salami in your purse and eating it when no one’s looking so you won’t get hungry. But Collen Patrick-Goudreau, a vegan and the founder of Compassionate Cooks, says that’s baloney. She recommends contacting the host and, after profusely thanking her for the invite, telling her that you’re vegetarian. You could then offer to bring a vegetarian main dish such as stuffed pumpkins, or ask the host to set aside a small bowl of stuffing and other side dishes so you can add your own non-meat ingredients. If you know the host well, you might even advise her as to how to prepare a vegetarian side dish. “I encourage people to live their own values and stop worrying what the truth will do,” she said.

I think both ideas are a little preposterous, to tell you the truth, Jenny. Putting salami in your purse is just plain gross, even if it’s vegan. And asking your host if she wouldn’t mind cooking you a vegan turkey is kind of like asking your friend if you look fat in those jeans. What is she supposed to say?

I recommend reminding your friend that you’re a vegetarian, just so her family isn’t surprised, and bringing a side dish that you can eat. You’re supposed to contribute something as a guest anyway. Then you can fill up on side dishes, or at least put some other ones on your plate. I have found that if you move your food around your plate just so, people won’t even notice if you’re eating a lot of the same thing -- or nothing at all. Although if you really want to make sure you’ll get enough to eat, you can take after the Maori and bury an extra dish in your friend's backyard a few days before the big meal. Dig it up only in the case of emergency.

-- Alana

Photo: At least they're glad you don't want any part of the Thanksgiving turkey. Credit: Vicki's Nature via Flickr

Comments

[Ron oliver]

Re: screaming baby on plane -

four words: "catbox in the hold".

in cargo, no one can hear you scream.

[susana]

I am a vegetarian and what I plan to do is eat before I go to the party so I won't be gnawing at my arm and become the first vegetarian to go fro no meat to human meat. I'm making a veggie pizza for everyone to enjoy. There are so many soy-based "meat" products out there, there is no reason for anyone not to enjoy a nice Thanksgiving dinner. When I am at the party, I will load my plate with mashed potatoes, yams, pumpkin pie with ice cream and salad. NO one will be the smarter that I have already satisfied my hunger and thus indulge (moderately) on my favorite Thanksgiving dishes! I would suggest keeping the answer short when asked why you are a vegetarian. Simply state I do not eat meat because it's good for me. :) And smile. No need to go on as to why you have converted to an herbivore!

[Bethany]

The questioner is right, however. For some reason, people do get offended when you don't eat their food. I know of no real fix for that, except politely saying you don't eat meat, as the commenter said. Until people stop fretting over other people's eating habits, we vegetarians are still going to have to be subject to a grilling now and then.

[Kevin]

Dear Amy Alcon:

Is it impolite to inform an advice columnist that "unpolite" is not a word?

[Karen]

Alana,

Not too pleased with your snarky answer to the vegetarian to wrote in to ask how to handle a Thanksgiving invite.

I always offer to bring vegetarian dishes that everyone can enjoy to Thanksgiving family or friends dinners.

One of the best vegetarian Thanksgiving recipes I found was from an article from last years NY Times ( A GOOD APPETITE; Side Dish or Main, Depending on Who's Eating http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9500E7D9153CF937A25752C1A9619C8B63.)

This year, thanks to Sarah Palin famous disturbing turkey video, my mother for the first time in 91 years will be skipping turkey, making life simpler for me.

We will be serving Quorn Turk'y Roast, a really yummy meat alternative made from a product called mycoprotein. Even meat eaters enjoy it.

Happy Thanksgiving.

[Austin]

The best general plan is to either eat before time or plan to eat afterwards. Unfortunately many people do get offended if you don't eat the dead bird, and DEMAND to know why not. If you want a peaceful Holiday you MUST dodge these questions; they usually don't want to know the answers anyway.

If you know the cook and ask politely you may learn that the corn, mashed potatoes, sweet potatoes, salad, stuffing, etc. have been made without lard, meat, or dairy & you can have a full satisfying meal anyway!

A great idea is to also have a separate celebratory meal with other vegetarians- perhaps a potluck. My wife and I did this for a few years with a group that would also invite a turkey from a local farm sanctuary. So our "turkey dinner" was enjoyed by all including the turkey.

[veg]

Austin is right. People really don't want to hear the real reasons why you've become a vegetarian, so it's best to just smile and say, "I just don't eat meat." There's so much food on Thanksgiving, I find it to be almost a relief that I don't have to eat the main dish ( a dead bird). After all the rolls, sweet potatoes, salads, and pies, I'm stuffed! I recommend that you just enjoy the company and have a glass of wine. If you don't make a big deal out of it, no one else will. Turkey is just one of many dishes served on Thanksgiving. And I've been a vegetarian for over 20 years!

[Nicole]

I find it incredibly easy to be a vegetarian at holiday meals. Most people who are uncomfortable addressing dietary concerns - especially chosen ones as opposed to, say, allergies - are dealing with an emotional insecurity "reject my food, reject me" or are struggling with their own guilt about eating meat, so I consider it my job to help them back into a comfort zone.

I make sure to spend some time with the hosts, sincerely communicate my appreciation for accommodating me and compliment the other, non-food aspects of her efforts. I usually look at dinners as an opportunity to help people realize they don't have to always use animal products, not through rhetoric, but by serving them something undeniably delicious. People often simply haven't been exposed to vegetarian options...and I don't mean tofu or fake meat substitutes, but rather just wholesome vegetable and grain dishes.

Being a vegetarian means you are in for some of ignorance and defensiveness, like a lightweight version of what most other minorities are faced with by being different. Such as you making the leap from informing a hostess of dietary needs to expecting a non-vegetarian to come up with a vegan turkey, which I'm sure you realize is an absurd scenario that wouldn't happen in real life.

Perhaps you'll opt for less snark and more research next time this question comes up?

[Confused]

Alana,

Wait this is a column about manners? I think that you would be the worst to spend Thanksgiving with....

[GEAH]

I quit going to my wife's family's holidays because my sister-in-law has decreed that because she and her children are vegetarians, then all shall be vegetarians.

[bjth]

Thanksgiving should not be used as an opportunity to convert or educate anyone's eating habits once that person is past the age of 7. Please bring yourself to dinner but not your agenda. Same thing for the hosts. Isn't the purpose to enjoy the company of those gathered at the table? If you're hosting the event, make certain there are plenty of vegetable-based dishes, fairly simple to do at Thanksgiving. Carrots, green beans and baby red potatoes presented on a bright yellow Fiesta platter? The carnivores will be fighting vegans for a helping. Make sure there's a big crudites selection with broccoli, celery, olives, cranberries. Bake some yams/sweet potatoes in advance that can nuked in the microwave quickly if someone doesn't want to gelatinous goop on the traditional servings. In season fruit in abundance is always a safe bet. The list could go on and on, but I won't.

Can't we all get along?

[Jessica]

This was an incredibly disappointing, ridiculous, and frankly, RUDE answer to the vegetarian Thanksgiving question. I wonder why Alana felt the need to be so snarky & unrealistic. Pushing the food around on my plate so no one notices I'm not eating meat?! Are you serious? I understand that the dinner table is not the place to share the nitty gritty details of vegetarianism, but I will always be honest (and tactful) when I answer questions about why I don't consume animal products.

Also, it is not rude to politely decline meat, especially if you give warning to the host about your dietary choices prior to the event. If they're a real friend, they will understand & respect your choice to honor all living creatures. Not eating meat is NOT an attack on them; it is honoring my values & staying true to what I believe is right. Vegetarians have nothing to apologize for.

And for the record, it is fun (and rewarding) to be a vegetarian (vegan, in my case) ALL year round--even at Thanksgiving. It's strange that Alana thinks the holiday ceases to be enjoyable if a dead bird isn't the centerpiece of the table... Sure, it can be difficult seeing all the media coverage about how to prepare said dead turkey--but I remind myself that the real meaning of this holiday is to give thanks & think of all the reasons I am fortunate in life. It's really too bad that so many lose site of that & focus so much on the food.

[Patti]

I respect the choices that vegan/vegetarians have made. However, I recall one holiday meal that was totally uncomfortable because the very vocal vegan brother of one of her roommates just showed up unannounced for dinner. The only items on the menu that I could guarantee were vegan safe were the cranberries and the steamed broccoli. His sister made some butter/cream laden mashed potatoes and then lied to him about it. I felt awful. There were several items I could have tweaked easily, if I had known ahead of time. Please let the host know ahead of time about whatever your dietary restriction may be.

[Laura]

I’m glad to see the comments to this vegetarian Thanksgiving question are more fair and sensitive and less dismissive than those of the advice columnist.

I agree that dinner time is not the time to spew forth reasons not to eat animals. I also agree that bringing a vegetarian dish to a gathering for all to share is not only the best way to ensure there’s food for the herbivore but also a great way to show others less familiar with plant-based meals how preparing vegetables can be done.

Alana, in response to Ms. Patrick-Goudrerau’s suggestion, "If you know the host well, you might even advise her as to how to prepare a vegetarian side dish," you not only call it "a little preposterous" but also twist it into "asking your host if she wouldn't mind cooking you a vegan turkey…" How preparing a vegetarian side dish equates to cooking a vegan turkey in any way is beyond me. You turned up the drama dial to MAX just in an attempt to shoot holes in some reasonable yet disagreeable-to-you advice. If you're going to refute something, be fair about it and don't exaggerate what was said. Additionally, to even reprint a quote that states, "it's unpolite [sic] to have all these special dietary needs," is not only insensitive but irresponsible. No one would sneeze at someone coming to the table and asking if peanuts are in the dish for fear of a constricted airway but asking whether there is beef stock in the stuffing in an effort to remove oneself from the cycle of the inhumane treatment of food animals is seen as absurd. There’s nothing impolite in either situation.

It would behoove us all if we would embrace and educate ourselves of the life styles of vegans and vegetarians who, for the most part, choose their conscientious eating habits out of compassion for life for all beings. Mocking them or belittling their stance does nothing more than put a wedge between us at a time when togetherness and thanks is meant to be celebrated.