Congress stunned by Bush officials disdain on torture

Democrats in Congress are still reeling over the lip they got yesterday from the Bush administration's key experts on torture. Vice President Dick Cheney chief of staff David Addington was so disdainful that some are wondering if he can be prosecuted for lying to Congress.

"Of all the hearings I've attended since I started serving on the Judiciary Committee four years ago, I have never felt more strongly that a witness was lying," Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz (D-Fla.) said in an interview. "At the end of the day I'm not sure how much we can do -- we can't prove what he says he doesn't recollect."

The Judiciary Committee is looking into whether former Justice Department official John Yoo's claim of executive privilege will fly. In the meantime, key clips of Addington's snarky responses to members of Congress are making the highlight reels.

Wasserman Schultz questioned Addington about his visits to Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, asking whether he discussed interrogation techniques with officials there.

Addington said he did not recall.

"It is hard to fathom you would not have recollections on specific conversations on types of interrogations methods," Wasserman Schultz said.

"Is there a questioned appended, ma'am?" Addington said.

"I don't believe that you do not recall whether you discussed specific interrogation methods. So I will ask you again."

"As I said to you," Addington said, "I don't recall."

Here's Chairman John Conyers trying to elicit Addington's legal justification for Bush's directives on harsh interrogation techniques.

Conyers: Do you feel that the unitary theory of the executive allows the president to do things over and above the stated law of the land?

Addington: The Constitution binds all of us, congressman, the president, all the U.S. members of Congress, all of the federal judges. We all take an oath to support and defend it. I frankly don't know what you mean by the Unitary Theory of Government. I don't --

Conyers: Have you ever heard of that theory before?

Addington: Oh I have, I've seen it in the newspapers all the time --

Conyers: Do you support it?

Addington: I don't know what it is.

Conyers: You don't know what it is.

Addington: No, and it's always described as something Addington's the great, you know --

Conyers: I see.

Update: Full report of the hearing here.

-- Johanna Neuman

Photo: Lawrence Jackson / Associated Press

Comments

[Justin Cayse]

It's all a whitewashed lie to begin with. The people, Congress, and the Senate have all agreed to tolerate this sidestepping of the constitution. As long as the American people continue to to allow this fascist regime to terrorize ourselves, nothing will ever change. Gas, torture, the war, food prices, disaster recovery, and global warming are all related. Until the American people decide that enough is enough, nothing will change. Not even when we put Obama in the white house. He too, is part of the problem. Why aren't we protesting? Because deep down inside, we are fascists, and we will kill and take what we want. That's why we are at war, and that's why we were attacked on 9/11. Why do they hate us? Because America thieves resources from poor countries.

[Fred K]

Keep on talking you guys. You haven't got the guts to DO something about it.

You haven't understood yet that it doesn't matter who gets in next. They will all continue in the destruction of America, democrat or republican (if there is an election at all).

Did you know that Bush just declared a 'State of Emergency' for the US? The next step will most likely be martial law.

Did you know that the US and Israel were on the way to bomb Iran when Putin told them that he ordered a nuclear strike if they attack Iran. Luckily they aborted their insanity - for now.

In order to accomplish something against the insanely criminal administration you have to do more than talk.

[LaSalle]

It's heartwarming to see 'open-minded' liberals reduced to name calling and stereotyping. Pathetic.

[Mike]

Set them all free! let them swim home and chum the water!

[Matt Lechner]

The other question is why do our "elected officials" like Representative Conyers (chairman of the house judiciary committee) selectively close their eyes to situations like the one I just disclosed involving Judge Real and the use of court police as a harassment tool against law-abiding American citizens. Maybe it goes back to who is paying for what. The lawyers for the other side had Elliot Spitzer on their payroll, (it's a securities related case) so the fact that when they made their "donations" to Elliott Spitzer's campaign to become governor, Spitzer was NYS attorney general, one of America's top one or two securities regulators. Hey, I understand, the Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher people (the lawyers for Capital Group / American Funds) donated money to a big-time democratic public lawyer / regulator (Spitzer), Conyers is a democrat, so who cares if the court police physically come to my house all the way across the country to harass me. There is something called the Hobbs Act that can be used to put elected officials in jail if they "sell their office". Did that happen in this case ? According to the New York State Board of Elections website, the lawyers for the other side, the Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher people (big movers and shakers in California to be sure) gave quite a chunk of money to Elliot Spitzer when their client Capital Group / American Funds was under formal investigation by other people including the California State Attorney General regarding their brokerage practices. Was that rather hefty donation a mere coincidence ? Maybe, but maybe not too likely. What is a California law firm that specializes in securities doing giving money to the New York State Attorney General, much of whose job is securities regulation ? Maybe that's why Conyers let Judge Real harass me with the court police, because the other side had the democratic political machine on its payroll and he was too chicken to rock the boat. Maybe the starting point is not using dummy brokerage front companies to bid in vendor competitions for the California State Retirement System in the first place. And not letting the lawyers put the state attorney general on their payroll. Then maybe the court police, even if they were ordered to go harass someone, might ask themselves "Now why are we going to this guy's house ?" and not do it next time.

[Steve Z]

Do the ends justify the means? In future conflicts will our servicemen be treated the same way we treat our "enemy combatants"? If that's the case why pretend to be moral? It worked for Hitler. In this case it's all of those pesky muslims. Why, I believe that one column writer for the LAT was saying it wasn't really torture, just a policy decision. Hmmm. Like our energy policy or our economic policy. Well, since the war is being conducted to the same standards of competency we've been experiencing in all other areas of gov policy then guys like J.McIntosh should really watch out, you are cannon fodder for the Bush agenda. Iraq is simply another Vietnam... That one cost us 50,000 guys to ultimately make the world safer for Walmart. Be safe out there J., but remember nothing you do will change anything. Ancient tribal rivalries in a culture we can't relate to will not be solved by white guys with guns.

[Matt Lechner]

maybe that's the upstream point where the "Star-Chamber" justice that lawyers, judges, and politicians are so fond of really gets its foothold, with someone like a state attorney general being on the payroll

then they use the police like a private enforcement squad

[Limey]

It easy to see by Addington's comments, they did not resemble answers in any way, just what the meaning of the words "obfuscation" and "prevarication" are.You don't have to lie you just don't have to answer the question or at best you say that you can't "recall"....
This method of being evasive is just what the "enemy" is taught to use when they are being interrogated and it would not surprise me if this supercilious Addington person was taught this technique as well.In fact this whole administration have been taking lessons from the very people that are are delighted to indulge themselves in torture techniques.That is why torture is the only thing left to use...you'll never get straight honest and meaningful answers from people that have practiced this technique so often even they don't know what the truth is anymore....!
It presents so much frustration all round that just about everyone in their pursuit of some semblance of "veracity" would most likely resort to torture if they thought that would produce the honest answers they seek.
In short I think that the whole issue of how politicians conduct themselves with respect to any recognizable moral authority, in a time when the world so desperately needs it,has degenerated into one big game of wits and we are all headed into a state of absolute moral madness brought on by the likes of this very duplicitous Addington snake in the grass and his fellow slithering cronies...

[THROW THE TRAITERS OUT OF THE U.S.]

THESE BEASTS ARE NOT MEN.

THOSE WHO ADVICATE TORTURE ARE NOT MEN BUT ANIMALS, BEASTS!

THE CONSTITUTION CLEARLY STATES THAT WE AS A NATION MUST UPHOLD INTERNATIONAL TRIETYS!

GOD BLESS THOSE TORMENTED SOULS THAT THINK TORTURE IS OK!

[sjtom]

Every politician in D.C. is merely trying to cover his or her butt because it's an election year. They sat and did nothing for years. Kick 'em all out and start from scratch. Otherwise we'll never see anything new.

[edward]

The bastards all deserve what they claim is not torture and then drawing and quartering. I am so tired of these lying arrogant snobs, and their ways from the president on down to their cronies at local levels. They have broken our country economically, and gained the disdain of all the countries in the world .I can only pray that God rejects them and the world sentences them in war crime trials.

[abby0802]

Criminals are in charge of the White House and Congress is "stunned." There is nothing that would surprise me about this administration's lack of respect for law, decency, or democracy. They do what they please and accuse those who insist on the rule of law, decency, and democracy of being "soft on terror" or "traitors" or whatever terminology to create fear in the minds of the voters. Well, wake up America! The traitors are in the White House. They have betrayed this country's ideals for oil.

[A Real Conservative]

Waterboard him... he'll recall. This B.S. verbal fencing gives conservatism a bad name. Addington is the poster child Obama is looking for.

[Aaron Richoux]

Sounds clear to me.
Conyers: Do you feel that the unitary theory of the executive allows the president to do things over and above the stated law of the land?

Addington then said no one is above the law. and then said he was not clear on what the sentaor meant by "unitary theory"

An argument ensues were sentor does not say what he means by "unitary therory" in this context. Addington says when he uses unitary he means it in the sense of the article 2 of the constitution when says all executive power is vested in the president, none to the congress.

What DOES the senator mean by this question any way? From the way I understand it unitary executive theory means that it is unconstitutional for Congress or a group acting for the congress to execute laws. The only congress makes law, only the president executes the law and only the judicial branch interprets the law.

Lets hear some really interesting questions like some of the ones in the comments here not this Oprah Winfrey "Oh, no, she didn't!!" stuff.

[getsix]

i hope the ones held and being abused get there day in court they should be brought here in california and new york city and relesed or maybe a small bail and have there trials held here hear they can file lawsuits and get what they deserve

[endo]

isn't it ironic that if torture were OPENLY practiced by the govt, they'd probably go right after this little tight-lipped bagman?

[Tom in California]

People very like Addington and Yoo were hanged after the Nuremburg Trials.

[Rob Z]

The far left has pushed their stupid insanity too far. A 5-4 ruling on the right to bear arms? What is going on? 4 liberal justices want to take away your rights. They spit on the constitution. And you support them. You liberals make me sick. Liberal jerks need to take a good look at what they support. When their "elected" officials get enough power they will make them march like captives to Batan. For the good of society..I can't wait. The sooner you lemmings are gone the better. Leave the country to the people that care about it. We're tired of you telling us what's good for us and how to live. Waterboarding is torture. Who the hell cares? So is prison for life. So is listening to Commrade Barack. Wake up and smell the coffee. If you, like Susan Sarandon and Alec Baldwin, want to move to somewhere else...GET THE HELL OUT!! Take Barack with you. One last thing...every liberal on this post will scream that they are moderate, not far left. Remember the images of Pelosi, the power grubbing wench of the House, after clutching the gavel like a trophy...in her dilusional psychosis she maintains she's a moderate. No respect for the office, no respect for the power, no respect for the people. She'll tell you what to do...you liberals will march lock step...and the rest of America will dismiss her and her party like the bitter losers clinging to their atheism with no where to turn.

[PulSamsara]

The GOP have failed this country.

[Sanjiv Goel]

It is not surprising the way in which Mr Addington and Mr Yoo behaved.
They are necrotic appendages of a corrupt and evil administration that has a President and Vice President who are traitors for ratting their own CIA
agent. They misled the country into a war that was based on a lie. Spent billions/Trillions of dollars, that we do not have ,to fund the corporate welfare of
Hallibuton and its likes.
Gas prices are touching 5 dollars in california.The adminstration has turned a blind eye to the lending practices so the subprime mortgage fiasco benefited the corporations and Americans lost homes.
List of the administration follies goes on and on.(medicare,social security,etc etc)
SENATE and CONGRESS are impotent ,castarated, ass kissing EUNUCHS
THEY DESERVE TO BE SPAT IN THEIR FACES BY ADDINGTON AND YOO !!!
SENATE and CONGRESS HAVE SLEPT FOR 8 YEARS.

[Sanjiv Goel]

Mr Yoo is an example of Nature gone wrong.He is an extremly poor excuse to be a part of Homo Sapien race.He now teaches at Berkley,what he teaches is a mystery , perhaps a course in "Legalized American torture101, Bush stlyle ".If anyone has read his interpretation of
torture it will become clear that lawyers can twist and turn anything and convert gold into lead.(magical alchemy).Mr Yoo wrote that if the torture caused severe bodily pain but did not inflict deadly injury then it was not be considered torture, etc etc. his explanations were quite similar to someone who is inflicted by tertiary Syphilis.
The Chancellors at the UC system let this animal teach Law at Berkely is a matter of shame.

[sharpsteve]

John Yoo has said that the president can authorize the crushing of a child's genitals with pliers in front of their parents during interrogation to get info. Maybe next time he is testi-lying before congress they should get out the pliers and use them on him to see if his tactics will work to get him to answer questions truthfully to congress and the American people.

How much more of this will it take before the American people wake up and demand not just impeachment but WAR CRIMES trials for Bush and his gang of thugs and killers?

WAKE UP AMERICA BECAUSE YOU ARE NEXT ON THEIR LIST! WILL YOU FINALLY STAND UP AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS WHEN YOUR CHILD'S GENITALS ARE BEING CRUSHED BY THESE CRIMINALS?

[Fred K]

You Republicans can continue to blame the Democrats and you Democrats can continue to blame the Republicans. You are both wrong. Look at the past. Did a democratic administration continue on the path of the republican Administration when they were voted in? Yes! Every time. Did the republican Administration continue on the path of the democratic Administration when they were voted in? Of course they did!

So, what are you guys complaining about? You have been watching this back and forth for decades and you haven't caught on yet. Shame on you.

You are the ones who let these criminals get away with it. The only thing you do and you have the courage to do is to complain about it.

It will not take long and you will not even be allowed to complain anymore.

No one can or will be free that asks security from the government. Governments are inherently criminal. If Americans haven't got the courage to stop this criminality in government they deserve everything they get because they allow it to happen.

Don't forget that a government is the exact mirror image of the moral level of its citizens.

[Robert Wheeldon]

According to many of the commenters here, I was tortured during my Escape and Evasion training in 1969. Interesting how times have changed.

For the person(s) who think the GOP has failed the country, may I suggest it was the CIA, FBI and Clinton Administration failures that lead to Islamofascists being sufficently well organized to murder 3000 Americans on 9/11. Have you forgotten that. Shortly after 9/11 the battle cry was never forget and my comment was that many of America's Left would never remember. Are YOU one of them?

For the life of my, I do not understand why anyone wants to give illegal combatants (enemy soldiers out-of-uniform) more rights than are afforded POWs. POWs are NEVER afforded a heabus corpus hearing. In past wars, enemy soldiers out-of-uniform were executed on the battlefield (eg. Major John Andre if you know any history).

[Doug Martin]

Treating prisoners, detainees, and enemy-combatants humanely is important for a number of reasons. It is the law. It is the right thing to do. Almost as important, we can expect that when US citizens are captured by others, that the standards by which we treated those in US custody, will be one of the measures used for their treatment.

When the World Trade Center was attacked, it was a criminal act. Those involved in any way, who were not in the planes during the attack, should have been prosecuted to the full extent of the law. I fail to see any good reason to use the criminal acts of a few, as the basis for an undeclared war on terror where the US public does not know precisely who the enemy is. Over the past seven years, there have been few limits placed on the power of those who claim to be fighting the war on terror. Some people in the US do not see unchecked power as being a good thing for our country. Others see this as a good thing, believing that security is more important than limited government. History will judge. One can only imagine what Patrick Henry would say.

By the way - how many times has the United States Congress declared War? I count five times. Of those instances where Congress has declared war, looking back based on the historical record, I can see only two instances where there were just causes for declaring war: The War of 1812 (the survival of our country depended on defending the nation); and WWII (we were attacked by the government of Japan, leading Germany's government to declare war on the US). (Civil war was not a declared war, nor were many other actions involving US military forces).

The other declared wars were in my estimation about as reasonable as our treatment of native Americans during the 19th century: The Mexican American War; Spanish American War; WWI. None of these wars were a necessity, nor did our nation's survival depend on declaring war.

History judges all.