Congress stunned by Bush officials disdain on torture

Democrats in Congress are still reeling over the lip they got yesterday from the Bush administration's key experts on torture. Vice President Dick Cheney chief of staff David Addington was so disdainful that some are wondering if he can be prosecuted for lying to Congress.

"Of all the hearings I've attended since I started serving on the Judiciary Committee four years ago, I have never felt more strongly that a witness was lying," Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz (D-Fla.) said in an interview. "At the end of the day I'm not sure how much we can do -- we can't prove what he says he doesn't recollect."

The Judiciary Committee is looking into whether former Justice Department official John Yoo's claim of executive privilege will fly. In the meantime, key clips of Addington's snarky responses to members of Congress are making the highlight reels.

Wasserman Schultz questioned Addington about his visits to Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, asking whether he discussed interrogation techniques with officials there.

Addington said he did not recall.

"It is hard to fathom you would not have recollections on specific conversations on types of interrogations methods," Wasserman Schultz said.

"Is there a questioned appended, ma'am?" Addington said.

"I don't believe that you do not recall whether you discussed specific interrogation methods. So I will ask you again."

"As I said to you," Addington said, "I don't recall."

Here's Chairman John Conyers trying to elicit Addington's legal justification for Bush's directives on harsh interrogation techniques.

Conyers: Do you feel that the unitary theory of the executive allows the president to do things over and above the stated law of the land?

Addington: The Constitution binds all of us, congressman, the president, all the U.S. members of Congress, all of the federal judges. We all take an oath to support and defend it. I frankly don't know what you mean by the Unitary Theory of Government. I don't --

Conyers: Have you ever heard of that theory before?

Addington: Oh I have, I've seen it in the newspapers all the time --

Conyers: Do you support it?

Addington: I don't know what it is.

Conyers: You don't know what it is.

Addington: No, and it's always described as something Addington's the great, you know --

Conyers: I see.

Update: Full report of the hearing here.

-- Johanna Neuman

Photo: Lawrence Jackson / Associated Press

Comments

[Murray C.]

Water board him, and see if his memory comes back.

[Royce]

LOL that's the best comment I've ever read. Yeah waterboard him. In fact, let's waterboard anyone who's still arguing that it's not torture.

[R C Gray]

Addington is just one of the many pompous jerks (I'd prefer another word that won't get approved) in the Bush administration.

We can only hope that we survive the next few months until they all get thrown out.

R C Gray

[rudy]

He cant remember if went to Cuba or not. Well screw you you can't do anything to me. Serves the Senate right. The Senate has been kissing the administrations ass for so long now all of a sudden they dont like the smell. What did they expect. They have been acting like docile eunichs for eight years now all of a suddent they are going to get tuff.

They should have been thinking when they signed on the line going along with all the legislation that has brought this about. Their failure to act created the Imperial Court and now they don't like being treated like servants.

[windrider]

Since there is no legal definition of "unlawful combatant" and since there is no law spelling out rules of evidence or burden of proof for charging someone as an unlawful combatant, and since the President has unrestricted power to name ANYONE an unlawful/enemy combatant and lock them up forever, let's hope the next President declares them all enemy combatants: Addington, Yoo, Cheney, Perle, Wolfowicz, Rumsfelt, Rice, Bush and all the other vicious torture-loving members of this administration, lock 'em up, throw away the key. Oh yeah, and interrogate them to see if they still "don't recall".

[Bill]

Yeah there ya go. Waterboard him and I bet his memory will come back will real quick. Just another Bush cronie taking the sword for Bush and Cheney.

[Karolyn]

Truly, Addington and Woo both need to be subjected to harsh interrogation techniques in an effort to get to the truth. How much you want to bet lil' Davey and Johnny (who also stonewalled) would pee their panties and squeal like little girls as soon as someone showed up with a pail of water ( I like to picture that someone as Waxman)? I suspect their definition of torture, as well as their sh*t-eating grins and disrespect for their Congressional superiors, would change post-haste.

[sd-mouth]

What would we expect? Addington is part of the slime in the White House. He works for Cheney so there should be no surprise and that should answer for the arrogance that permeates this administration. Screw the constitution; screw the people of the US of A; screw the reputation of America. Make America into exactly what the terrorists hate. Recruit more bodies for them so that the fear monger Republicans can continue there destruction from within.
The stench will end in 196 days.
But, not with McCain; same theory with new players.

[Jon M.]

I have a problem understanding why anyone would use physical torture which can have dubious results.

Today there plenty of pharmaceuticals that can induce the interviewee to spill his guts and then with a few suggestions be put in his bed with no memory of being interrogated.

Many such legitimate medicines are used during brain surgery so that the patient can describe his reactions to the doctors.

There is also the recent drug Oxytocin which makes one utterly trust even total strangers.

Since around the time of WW I, there has been available Scopolamine. In South America it is called Burundanga and is used by muggers on Yankee tourists. The perps put it in a drink or just blow the powder into someone's face so that it can be inhaled. The victim is marched to an ATM where he cleans out his account. Then, with a few suggestions, he can be left somewhere with no memory of what happened.

Sodium pentothal, which is what most call truth serum, is not particularly effective because it induces a sort of drunkennes like state with the person having difficulty with memory and concentration.

It seems to me that physical torture may be deliberatily used to intimidate the prisoners and also to make them think that they have succeded in keeping their secrets, when in actuality they have spilled their guts through pharmaceuticals, but with no memory of what actually has happened.

[Khalid Abdullah]

Only serves to strengthen the old adage, "You are free to do what you want as long as you do what you are told."

Arrogant Pompous Lying Criminal

[Clem]

The Truth shall set you free. Arrogance and deceit are all these people know and love and it is their mantra not ours. Stand up for what is right and throw these criminals out, lock up the ones we can, and remember always the corruption that follows lack of vigilance. These people are the Mr. Jones that Dylan sang about. If they ever heard of John Lennon they never listened or learned. Any good lawyers out there? Now is your time to clear your name.

[Tom in California]

It is a disgrace to this country that Addington and Yoo walk free and flaunt their contempt for law and justice. These profoundly evil men belong in prison.

Unitary Theory of Government ?

Lets waterboard Conyers untill he explains how he thinks he was elected to govern .

[MarkB]

I'd say that Addington is still in the denail phase, acceptance of what is about to happen to him and the other idiots from the New American Century club is going to sink in sooner or later, like it did with McClellan.

Can the Democratic party manage to get all this to peak for election day?
Will Bush resign so that Cheney can pardon him and then resign to be pardoned by a new former VP? These guys have shown they would try anything.

I certainly want to see all these people facing the law and I don't want for it to happen while this administration is still in control of the Justice Department, because they have packed it with their croneys and law is only a secondary consideration there now.

[Dan West]

All you knuckle heads who would water board our officials... but deplore such for the folk that killed 3000 of your fellow Americans are sure lost in the mire of
liberal bleeding heart muck. If water boarding is so wrong why do you want to do it to anyone--much less some one trying to protect you? The problem with this procedure and any other similar "torture" is the public spotlight the liberal media and congress folk insist on shining on it. You have not be blown up lately
and don't even know why. You poor idiots!

[vade01]

These arrogant sycophants who work for the ruling class, and believe it makes them members of it will be the first ones sacrificed when the indictments come down. They're lucky as historically, they'd have been the first ones beheaded.

[Disgusted]

Is it any wonder other countries hate this country? What we can't steal we subjugate, what we can't control we thoroughly obfuscate with political commentary, what we can't push into modern day slavery we make plans to ensure that we do. Our government is being run by scum buckets and these inmates are running the mental wards! How can anyone love the political horizons esposed by the US? Just remember the sage saying: "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." It seems evil is on a straight track to hell and the engineer is the republican.

[RaferJanders]

Wow, angry little Addington, I hear tell Chenny won this
felcher in a card game with Satan.

[Matt Lechner]

It is nice to see Representative Conyers so on the ball these days. Not long ago, I reported what I believed to be harassment from Judge Manuel Real, the famous or should I say the infamous Los Angeles judge who has been the subject of impeachment proceedings by Congress and formal public rebuke by the judicial apparatus, by way of U.S. Marshalls sent to my home in New York State allegedly to "investigate if I were I threat to the Judge Real or any member of the 'judicial family' " after I complained in writing about Judge Real diverting court papers, in direct defiance of a recent written directive of the higher court above him, the United States Court of Appeals, saying if papers are given to the court clerk, they must be filed. My "complaint" was, if the U.S. Court of Appeals said the papers have to be filed when they get to the courthouse, then the papers are entitled to legal protection, just like the U.S. Mail, and the U.S. Marshalls are supposed to safeguard things in the courthouse, including documents. The appeals court said, in writing, if the papers are delivered to the court clerk, they have to be filed, period. In other words, the Judge can't divert them from the court clerk and chuck them or send them back to you if he feels like it. I then sent the complaint, about the court police forcing themselves onto my property, to Representative Conyers, because he is Chairman of the House Committee on the Judiciary, because I don't think it's right that if you complain about a judge well known to be a rogue judge that the court police show up at your house to harass you. Did Representative Conyers respond in any way to my complaint ? No, of course not. No call, no email, nothing. I guess if you complain that a judge did something wrong, the court police can come to your house and intimidate you. Who wrote that script, George Orwell ? Reference Matt Lechner v. Capital Group, (second) appeal now pending in the United States Court of Appeals - San Francisco, docket #07-56859. Where was Mr. Conyers, or maybe he liked the fact that the court police were sent to harass me. Think about that - you file a complaint about a judge, to the proper people in Congress, and the court police come harass you at your house. Talk about civil rights being trampled. And Representative Conyers did nothing about it, and he is head of that committee. Matt Lechner

[B-12]

It never ceases to amaze me how fickled Americans can be. Have we forgotten the threatening circumstances 7 years ago (which, by the way ,still continues) that led our leaders to make some tough choices. I remember that shortly after the 9/11 attacks, there were discussions by the authorities of how far should US authorities go to obtain the truth from "enemy combatants"...of "how far is too far" to ascertain information of possible additional plots, (including nuclear, biological / chemical attacks) and whether possibly sparing the lives of multitudes of Americans by foiling a destructive plot was a prudent exchange for the unfortunate but arguably necessary, prying of truth from "enemy combatants." My point is, It is easy to ridicule their decisions now, 7 years later, with no attacks on the mainland and with a November election in the works. I am thankful that inspite of any errors made, that up until now, information gathered may have saved or at least delayed the destruction of many Americans and/or others. If we had been attacked again, we probably would not be having this discussion, except maybe with those residing in Ivory Towers.

[jjfkdken]

this post is a good one,calling forth images of the french rev.....These arrogant sycophants who work for the ruling class, and believe it makes them members of it will be the first ones sacrificed when the indictments come down. They're lucky as historically, they'd have been the first ones beheaded.

Posted by: vade01 |

[VJ Machiavelli]

Look these terrorist are out to kill us. They will not stop until they kill all of us.

We need to do what ever it takes to keep us and the rest of the world safe.

If it means torture so be it. Because if we fail one day we will wake up with a mushroom cloud over one of our cities. Then it will be to late.

No amount of "Appeasement" or talking is going to stop them. It did not stop Hitler nor will it stop the terrorists. Only one thing will do that, and thats a .......
to the head.

VJ Machiavelli
http://www.vjmachiavelli.blogspot.com

[J.McIntosh]

Finally someone forced the Demorats to show their true colors. Willing to sacrifice national security for political gain. Disdain? I have nothing but contempt for Conyers, Pelosi, Clinton, and their ilk - they are as crooked as any politician, and willing to put American service members at greater risk for the sake to garner their own power and riches.

Prediction - democratic president & democratic congress - we will get our butts handed to us in the War on Terror.

You may not like Bush but how many attacks on America have their been since 9/11??? I serve in uniform and I would much rather fight the enemy in the desert than in the streets where my children play.

Wake up people! It's not a nice world out there. The Dems are dim. They will get us all killed.

[Robert C. Rogers]

Nothing in the Constitution bars a president from pardoning everyone including himself that was involved in this mess. Bush has nothing to loose, his legacy is in the toilet. That's why if you are going to get these guys, it might be already too late.

My first problem with how this went down (and yes the democrats should have shut this down at the start). When you have political appointees making decisions on what are "effective" methods of interrogation, and disregard experts with years of experience in the matter. A law degree and uber arrogance doesn't qualify you. Addington and Yoo should be disbarred and the process should start now. While you are at it yank their security clearance for life. Make sure their ugly heads never appear in government in the future.

To one of the comments above... Yes, we have lost 3000 people in the initial attack... But, we have laws and it sets us apart from the animals that attacked us... Bin Laden has almost fulfilled all that he set out to do... Economy in the toilet, republicans afraid that the boogie man is just around the corner, and the biggest prize the loss of rights to our citizens. The whole government played right into it.

Bottom line.... Congress better get off its rear... Time is running out... The get out of jail free card is about to be used....

The