Montecito fire wasn't an accident, officials say*

Fire officials still don't know what caused the Montecito fire, but they don't believe it was an accident. According to CNN, they are calling it "human caused" but stop far short of calling it arson.

Fire investigators say they have eliminated “all accidental causes” of the Tea fire in Santa Barbara County and are asking for the public’s help in finding who caused the suspicious blaze that destroyed 210 homes and caused 2 injuries. “We are calling it human caused and we need the public’s help in identifying any activity in or around the afternoon of Nov. 13th,” said Doug Lannon, a spokesman with the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection.

* Updated: The Times' Catherine Saillant reports that evacuation orders were lifted Sunday at 3:30 p.m. for all but 260 homes involved in the Tea fire. Firefighters have made good progress in a blaze that is no longer burning actively, said William Boyer, communications director for Santa Barbara County. "It’s not expanding,'' Boyer said of the 1,940-acre fire. "There’s still some hot spots. But there’s a very optimistic outlook at this point."

--Shelby Grad

A charred car rest in the middle of a smoldering landscape along Conejo Road due to the Tea fire in Santa Barbara on November 15, 2008. Photo by Genaro Molina / Los Angeles Times

Comments

[Allen]

While I can't offer any comment about the Montecito fire, from what I've heard, the Orange County/Corona fire was started by a cigarette tossed from a car that ignited some shrubs off the road, which then sent embers flying in the heavy Santa Ana winds... I don't get it -- why isn't there more of a concern in preventing people from throwing lit cigarettes out of cars?! Besides the fact that it is extremely inconsiderate, it's incredibly moronic to throw something that is technically still burning into the road, where it can ignite other things and start a fire. Personally, I think that, at a minimum, throwing a lit cigarette out of a car window should be considered attempted arson, with very serious penalties attached. If you know someone who does this, please make them aware of the seriousness of their actions.

[andy]

we should really watch out for the klan.......

[D. Murphy]

People are stupid. And cigarette smokers are even dumber.

Sitting in line at a gas station, I once observed a lady throw a cigarette out her window right onto a metal plate on top of a 10,000 gallon buried gas tank. I scolded the hell out of this lady inside the gas station's mini-mart. I said, why would you throw a cigarette on top of 10,000 gallons of gas and possibly blow us all up? At first, she gave the look of indignation, but realized her dumb mistakes and apologized.

[Haddie Nough]

We lived in Santa Cruz from 1989 through 1995 and they had a strictly enforced laws, I thought were state mandates. that issued a very substantial fine for anyone throwing a lit cigarette from a car or while walking, standing, or biking. The litter laws overall were very well enforced. However as the economy and tax revenue declined so did the police force and those laws and significant revenues dwindled also. What a shame, the state was much cleaner, the fire damages were reduced, and people who smoked were very conscientious.

Just look around when you're stopped at an intersection waiting for the light to change and notice all the butts in the gutters. Everyone of those none degrading pollutants are potential torches.

Enact laws, and strictly enforce them, hopefully you'll cut down on many these horrendously devastating infernos.
Haddie.

[Kris]

Not to mention, throwing a cigarette out a window is littering. Yet, I have never seen any smoker fined for such. Honestly, if I consumed something and threw the package on the ground when finished, I would be looked down upon. How did discarding cigarettes become acceptable?

[JimBob]

People throw cigs out of their car windows all the time. I see it in Laurel Canyon almost every time I go over the hill. All it takes is a bad bounce and some wind and you've got a tragic fire. Anyone, any time, throwing a cigarette out a car window should be considered a potential, or attempted, arsonist.

[sdwryter]

I was in traffic court one day (a friend's offense, not mine -- I swear) and some jerk tried to contest his ticket for littering because "it was just a cigarette." The judge had to tell him to shut up because he was just making his case worse. I was delighted that he got a big fine and had to pay for his transportation to and from his duty picking up freeway litter. He really just didn't get it.

People really are dumb.

[JoeT]

In California there is a specific law prohibiting "littering with an ignited objected". I know this because, as a smoker 20 years ago, I was driving on a freeway in SF and tyhrew my cigarette out the window, and was then stopped by a SFPD patrol person and given a ticket for it.

I was a smoker, and as such, was totally in denial of the hazards I was causing my own health by smoking. Looking back, I see this denial was extended to include my denial of potential harm to others I may have also been causing. Just look at all the grass fires that happen all the time, and how they happen right along our roadways. They have to have been caused by either cigarettes being thrown out by motorists, or by sunlight focused through discarded glass bottles, also thrown out by unthinking motorists.

[Judy Faust]

Most automakers are no longer putting ashtrays in cars as standard equiptment to deter smoking. They are now optional and smokers are just throwing thieir lit cigarettes out the window. They must be included in all cars.

[cq]

I think they should increase cigarette taxes in CA by 300% .s

[bob]

Smokers need to keep their butts in their automobiles.

Generally speaking, most people are morons. Smokers are even worse.

[Claire]

I agree with Judy - Not having an ashtray around doesn't deter smoking - it's an addiction! If there was an ashtray in the car, there is absolutely NO REASON for throwing the burning cigarette out of the window. Although automakers thought taking ashtrays out would deter smoking, I think it has just increased the number of butts that get thrown out the window.

[Marie]

As a smoker, I used to be ashamed of all the unfinished bottles of water/soda or half drunken coffee cups, filled with cigarette butts that litter my car (and even at times, my purse) until I dispose of them. All I know now, is that I am going to wear those butt filled containers with some small measure of pride. Tossing still hot cigarette butts out of a car window while driving in Southern California (or ANYWHERE for that matter), or tossing them on the ground, is filthy, disgusting, and DANGEROUS to our communities, and should be considered attempted arson.

[James Spain]

6 or so weeks ago, we were on Hwy. 1 and Sunset right near the beach and say an SUV throw a lit cigarette out of the window. We took the license plate in case there was a fire but I think we should be able to do more than that. I think it should be a serious (at least) ticket. We should be able to, as responsible citizens, file a complaint .... Hopefully without too much trouble, like having to take off of work... maybe our legislators could come up with something like, pay this ticket - or- if you fight it in court with a wittness, you'll have to PAY THIS TICKET!

[Robert of Simi Valley]

I totally agree. I was driving on the 118 westbound this past Sat and some idiot in a truck was flicking his cigarette out the window and onto the road. It was dawn so I saw the sparks hit the road and blow away. Isn't there a law against throwing cigarettes out of your car window? Arnold are you listening?

[suzkaca]

I have to wonder where some folks get their values sometime. I was stopped at a light and saw someone throw a used DIAPER out the window. Such blatant disregard for common decency. Sure that full diaper will smell up your car, but it's your kid - come prepared with a bag to put it in! Same for smokers - if your car does not have an ash tray then DUH don't smoke in it! I agree, it should be a big fine to throw anything out the window, especially something so potentially dangerous as a lit cigarette.

[Mike]

People aren't stupid, but sometimes they just need to be told what to do and what not to do. When I was a kid, any beach you would go to was covered with trash. It was OK to throw trash out of your car window. Not long ago it was OK to smoke in a public building. Not too long ago in human history people were still throwing the contents of chamber pots out the window and onto the street.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that we are living in an advanced society. Many among us only respond to slogans and fear. People who think logically and who think beyond what is best for themselves are not the majority here. You might say that Obama is proof that isn't true. I say that Obama's election is proof that some people are slow to realize their mistakes.

The solution to the problem is to create an ad campaign that has a catchy tune as: "Give a hoot, don't throw your butts out the window". Or, Paris Hilton deriding cigarette butt throwers as "Not hot". Or appeal to patriotism: "People who throw butts aren't patriotic. Real Americans don't throw butts".

[Dan]

As a committed smoker, I find this parade of assumptions and anger mostly amusing if not entirely insane. One person mentions how they heard one fire was started by someone disposing of a lit cigarette and everyone hops on the bash smoker band wagon. Additionally, one cannot be charged with attempted arson without an intention to light something on fire. I for one would like to offer some other more critical issues to consider. How about curbing development? What about better infrastructure to deal with fires?

[Concerned Citizen]

The comments I'm reading here are quite alarming. They generally show a level of intolerance that was previously limited to "Yes on 8" and "McCain-Palin" rallies. In other words, it is not the rhetoric we need during a time of crisis when people's homes are burning.

It is undoubtedly true that cigarette smokers are politically unpopular in California. This state taxes cigarettes heavily and some municipalities like Calabasas even ban cigarette smoking in private residences.

That being said, we should not allow the type of vigilante justice against smokers that "James Spain" proposes. Instead, let the police and the courts set law enforcement priorities and do not clog the judicial system with smoking tickets.

Nor is Indeed, there is absolutely no evidence (sans an unreliable hearsay rumor from "Allen") that burning cigarettes had anything to do with starting any of these fires. Because it does not appear that "Allen" has any personal knowledge of anything even remotely related to these fires, his words are irrelevant here.

And yet, "Allen" has miraculously opened the bowels of hatred with his verbal diarrhea against smokers and has everyone blaming them for the fires. Good job "Allen": You succeeded in making people angry at a minority group without any proof that it did anything wrong.

Moreover, people who throw cigarette butts out of car windows are not and should not be considered "arsonists." Traditionally, malice aforethought has been a required element for arson. This places arson in the same realm as murder. Despite contrary dogma, smoking is not akin to murder.

Even assuming that a lit cigarette starts a fire and kills someone, it is misguided to presume that such an act is malicious. Lest we forget, there is a difference between careless acts and evil acts. So, in sum, do not blame an unpopular minority for starting fires without any proof.

[Richard Hernandez]

How about those knuckleheads that do put out their butts in their car ashtray, and then empty the ashtray out onto the street or onto a parking lot! Smokers are the worst........

[karen]

I agree-I saw 2 people throw down lit butts into parking lots this weekend...I don't get how people can be so inconsiderate. What can you expect from people who sit outside smoking cigarettes when it is impossible to breathe in the smke filled air, yet they are purposely inhaling their own cigarette smoke as well as breathing in the outside smoky air.