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70% of African Americans backed Prop. 8, exit poll finds

A lot of Obama/Yes-on-8 voters? The Associated Press exit polls show that African Americans and Latinos backed Proposition 8 in good numbers. Details here from AP:

California's black and Latino voters, who turned out in droves for Barack Obama, also provided key support in favor of the state's same-sex marriage ban. Seven in 10 black voters backed a successful ballot measure to overturn the California Supreme Court's May decision allowing same-sex marriage, according to exit polls for The Associated Press.

More than half of Latino voters supported Proposition 8, while whites were split. Religious groups led the tightly organized campaign for the measure, and religious voters were decisive in getting it passed. Of the seven in 10 voters who described themselves as Christian, two-thirds backed the initiative. Married voters and voters with children strongly supported Proposition 8. Unmarried voters were heavily opposed.

-- Shelby Grad

Photo: Los Angeles Times

 
Comments () | Archives (399)

It is laughable to equate being against gay 'marriage' and discrimination. Is it discrimination to be against 2 men marrying 4 women and call that group of 6 'married'?

First...I'm sorry but it is incredibly RIDICULOUS the implication that ...somehow... voting for Obama was a "favor" to the black community that was to be "paid back" by a no vote on 8.

When did this deal take place and who made it?

It completely invalidates Barack Obama as a candidate to make it seem as if white people did black people a favor by voting for him. We did the world a favor. Barack Obama was not "black people's candidate" He was a canadidate who happened to be black and he has nothing to do with this mess.

The black community owes the gay community nothing. We would hope that people would be empathetic and sympathetic to the plight of other minotity groups but...you are not OWED that empathy or sympathy.

Second...SINCE WHEN are exit polls reliable??

Third...and this is an honest question, not snarky...but can someone please explain the difference b/w domestic partnerships and being able to say you're "married" Is it just a semantic difference? Are there other benefits to marriage that DPs do not provide?

This is not about discrimination, never has been. This is about preserving the fundamental unit of society for future generations. Our future generations are entitled to the same rights we all enjoy--the presumed right to a father and mother, not just 2 parents of any gender. Gay marriage proponents are looking at this selfishly. They want to be married and damn the consequences to society. They want to pretend that 2 mothers or 2 fathers are equal to a father and mother. This is simply not the case. Fathers and mothers are different, and each are equally important in raising children. Sometimes children are denied this through others' choices or life consequences, but it should never be by state decree.

Classy. And after white people worked tirelessly to get Obama elected. Please, someone, pull all these knives out of my Obama-shirted back.

Let's not blame blacks and Hispanics for our failure to win allies in their communities. African-African political leaders are some of the staunchest supporters of LGBT rights in this country. Rep. Barney Frank has stated that, not just me. In fact, Frank says African-American representatives in Congress are more supportive than the gay US representatives (if you include the closet Republican reps who vote against themselves)!

We shall all overcome someday. "The moral arch of the universe is long, but in the end it bends toward justice"! But, as Barack says, we have to bend it!

Peace to all!

I dont know whether it speaks more to the persistent ignorance of blacks, fundamentalist religious indoctrination in their community, longstanding reverse bigotry by blacks, or some other factor.

Gays voted overwhelmingly for the black presidential candidate.

What a fabulous way to repay the favor -- blacks concurrently, on the same exact ballot then voting to deny others a small slice of the civil rights they have demanded for themselves! MLK would be ashamed. It's now all so tainted.

I want to see what Mr. Obama has to say about this terrible, bigoted decision.

To Black Christian shocked that “Apparently one-third of so-called Christians only believe a portion of God's word.” Yes make sure you don’t forget these Biblical words of morality.

Exodus 21:20-21
20 If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, 21 but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property
Leviticus 25:44
Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves…
Titus 2:9
Teach slaves to be subject to their masters in everything, to try to please them, not to talk back to them,
1 Peter 2:18
Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh.
1 Corinthians 14:34:
34women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says.
1 Timothy 2:11 -12
11 A woman should learn in quietness and full submission
12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.

As a black man I am saddened, but not surprised by the majority of black people who voted "yes". I voted no and in fact do equate our civil rights struggle with the struggle of gays to be fully recognized citizens. What I am surprised by is that the gay commulnity didn't recognize this political threat to something so important to them and didn't actively pursue the black vote. The gay community needed to have be in local black churches, who seem to have too much sway with the black vote. The gay argument needed to be framed too, as a civil rights argument, directly to black voters. This is politics people, wake up, the deal here is that the black vote is attainable, but just to leave it to fate, is ridiculous. The black community and the black vote has to be courted, not taken for granted, and this thing can be turned around. All the arguments by the gay community to the black community are valid, gays should feel stabbed in the back, but who's short sighted political thinking is to blame. You better believe the opposition was aware of this, they have even stated such on out takes. Gays need to run a better campaign, didn't we all learn this?

In addition to religion, this is an issue of education. The Black Community is less educated than the White Community. 49% of White people voted for this anti-Gay initiative in California while 70% of Black voters voted for it. But time is on our side. The ignorant will eventually awaken.

Sometimes those who think they are so educated, end up throwing God out of their lives, and end up with no moral compass to guide them. Just because African Americans don't have as much money to attend Godless institutions such as Berkley and be indoctrinated by them, doesn't mean they cannot think for themselves. Those against Prop 8 blame Christian churches for Prop 8 winning, maybe those who who are against normal marriage have been indoctrinated by their institutions and the media they choose to listen too.

It is a sad day when the people of California choose to vote for discrimination to be put into our State Constitution. How can the people of California stand by and not be outraged by this discrimination. It is time to stand up and overturn this discriminatory law. Those who chose silence are just as liable for as those who sat idle in 1942 when the 110,000 Americans of Japanese decent were put in internment camps or when interracial couples could not marry. We fail to remember that Alabama was the last state to allow interracial couples to marry in 2000 with an alarming 48 percent of the Alabama population still wanting to ban those loving unions. If gay marriage is repealed, what makes this slippery slope not start the ball rolling for a ban on interracial couples from marring? Will the Americans of African decent then say that the gay issue is not a civil rights issue?

The fact is that there is still substantial bigotry against the LGBT community, as strange and unbelievable as that may seem given the recent news. I find it amazing that civil rights have to be gained so incrementally, but the reason for that and all bigotry is rooted in fear and control. People invoke the Bible, sexuality, and race (among other things) to give themselves a sense of control in their lives. It is an illusion that momentarily makes them feel a sense of security and righteousness. Trouble is, they're fooling themselves.

In the end, justice will be done. Keep up the fight brothers & sisters. Look how long it took for us to elect a black man. The LGBT community has moved very fast in comparison.

It's sad and perplexing that millions of people who were excited about this election, as a chance to triumph over one form of discrimination, also used it as an opportunity to enshrine another form of it in the state constitution. For those who can't fathom the paralllels between the two, it's telling that Prop. 8 was so heavily backed and funded by the Mormon church, which started with a core belief in the inferiority of black people, and was only shamed out of that stance in the late 70's. But whatever.

I won't let these statistics seduce me into the circle of prejudice and resentment. As a dirt-poor gay guy (yes, there really is such a thing) who did everything I could to help Obama get elected, I am thrilled that he is finally our President. My grandparents would have never voted for a black man, but here I am. Similarly, most of these voters' grandchildren willl not stand for denying gay people their full civil and human rights. Acceptance eventually defeats bigotry, love eventually overcomes hate, it just takes time and patience.

Gays have the same rights heterosexuals have, and that is the right to marry someone of the opposite sex like everybody else. Gays just want extra rights. According to Prop 8 opponent's argument then why don't we let more then two people marry, siblings marry, parent and child, etc. Every society has to set standards for what is best for a society, or everyone will be crying discrimination and demanding them under the guise of civil rights. It takes an egg and a sperm to create life. Until you can get around that fact, the need to raise children with a mother and the father will always be there. Sons and daughters need the instruction and care of both to mature into productive adults. We've seen the impact of broken and fatherless homes in the black community - poverty, substance abuse, crime, incarceration, and early death. Thankfully blacks got it and voted wisely for Prop 8.

Just because someone states change it does not automatically mean good. Hitler was promoting change for the better, but in fact this was untrue. Many Jews were opressed by the Germans, because Hitler believed that his beliefs were right. People are quick to point the finger because it is partly because of the proof based on statistics. Of course this does not apply to ALL AA, but it does fall under the majority. If you do not believe that it applies to you then you should not be getting so upset over it, if you feel no guilt into why prop 8 has passed. In general, it is funny how most AA just became registered voters to vote for a "so called Black president." If you do not want to be judge by the color of your skin, but of the reflection of your character then why contribute to the stereotypes. If you were given the right to vote previously, before Obama was a running canidate for president, then why not take advantage of that right. Since people see the ignorance of the AA race and how it seems that a majority of blacks contribute to their own stereotype, it makes it easier to point the finger. This is because statistics have shown that the 70% of the yes on prop 8 was that of AA. Now we must ask ourselves, would the statistics have stated the same if Obama was not running for president? Would as many AA be registered to vote? Although I do believe that ignorant people use their religion as an excuse to judge and disriminate on the GLBT community, I do not think that the staggering number of registered AA votes would have been this high in supporting prop 8, given that most AA were 1st time voters just because the race of the presidential candidtate. So do not point fingers stating that the white liberalist is always trying to bring your race down, when clearly AA are contributing to their own negative stereotype. For those who use religion and God as an excuse to discriminate against others, you should be ashamed. Practice what you preech. Godalso stated that you should treat others the way you would like to be treated. In addition, we were all made in the likeness and image of God, so how do you know it is not God's will for people who are from the GLBT community to feel the way they do. They should have equal rights to marry each other on the basis of love, since love has no race, gender, color, etc. Marriage and domestic partnerships are totally different, and do not adhere the same rights. If you are married, then think about how it would make you feel if somebody took your right to marry away and stated that your marriage was no longer valid? And for those of you who say this is not a civil rights issue or a discrimination issue, you must be really uneducated because GLBTs are the minority, just like AA were in during the civil rights movement. GLBT community was supporting the civil rights movement and promoting EQUALITY FOR ALL...NOT EQUALITY FOR JUST ONE RACE...OR EQUALITY ONLY FOR HETEROSEXUALS. As somebody else pointed out, just because children learn about what Hitler did does not mean that they are going to all join the white supremacy. If you are so concerned about your child learning about gay and lesibian marrages because they might turn out gay themselves then that is your own insecurities. But if they are gay does that mean that you would love them any less? or treat them any different? Lastly, for those who have stated that GLBT have not gone through the hardship that AA slaves have gone through. This is totally false. You should research the hate crimes done on GLBTs. It is horrific, just as AA and Jews were subject to torture, GLBT also witnessed these events. They have been tied to fences, burned, murdered, raped, and the list continues. I'm not posting this so people can get mad. I just want people to realize where others stand and why people are so quick to point their fingers for Prop 8 passing.

It's a bit screwy that in this state, it takes fewer votes to strip people of a constitutional right than it does to pass a budget. It's kind of like not having a constitution at all.

All the bellyaching about courts throwing out your votes--sorry, but that's what happens when you vote for something which is in flagrant, obvious contradiction of the basis of our law, which is the constitution, not Leviticus. Which is fortunate, because shrimp, though an abomination unto the Lord, are pretty tasty.

So the push for marriage rights til now has been perfectly valid and reasonable, but now a slim majority of Californians have voted, for the moment, to make discrimination a part of the state constitution. Honestly, though I know challenges are being formulated to this absurd propostion, and I agree in principle, I really think we should just hold tight for a while. More legal wrangling to attain fleeting victories will be way less productive than just waiting a few years until the California electorate is finally ready to overturn this bigotry in a resounding, democratic manner.

Filter the election results by education, and you will see a correlation between those areas with with a high proportion of bachelors degrees and a No on 8 vote, and those areas with a low proportion of bachelors degrees and a yes on 8 vote. This discussion board seems to bear this out.

You don't have to be able to "see" a feature in order for it to be a feature accorded equal rights. Standing in line are two African American men, and two Caucasian men. Which one is mentally handicapped? If you need to be able to "see" the difference, then you must be arguing for the dissolution of rights for the mentally disabled as well.

If reproduction is the heart of marriage, then you must be against heterosexual marriages involving sterile people.

Obviously, the gay struggle in America has been nothing like what African Americans have faced. In fact, not much has. But if something needs to be qualitatively and quantitatively equal to the African American experience in order to be justifiably accorded rights against discrimination, well, then almost nothing else can be protected. I can see that the comparison is insulting. But that does not deny the fact that there can be discrimination to a lesser degree. It's not all or nothing.

7/10 African Americans voting yes on 8 is disturbing. But keep in mind this does mean that thousands of African Americans also voted no on 8. The yes on 8 campaign was smart. Black people are not the reason this was passed. This is not a reason to stop fighting for their causes.

And to Jennifer the PhD, how have you not heard of ad hominem with all of that rational thought of yours?

Let's stop being divided. I guess it's the census bureau that decides if you have more than 1/8 black in your blood than you are black.

But science should tell us differently. Barack Obama is mixed. His mother was white, and his father was black. That makes him mixed.

Therefore, voters didn't do "blacks" a favor by voting for Obama. He was a mixed candidate.

But black, white, latino, asian, gay, lesbian, straight, etc should have been voting for Obama because he was the better of two candidates.

Aaah, the great debate, is homosexuality a matter of pure choice, genetic propensity but chosen, or genetically deterministic?

Assuming that homsexuality is purely genetically determined, here is the future, parents will get the genetic test done on their unborn children, and given that I don't think that any non-homosexual would intentionally choose to bring a homosexual child into this world, then you can expect homosexuality to be treated as Down's, Parkinson's, CF, Tay-Sachs, or any number of other congenital conditions, where parents elect in over 90% of all such cases to terminate their pregnancies. I am against this too, as I said before, I am Catholic and take seriously my church's teachings in all things. It would also lend scientific credence to those who had classified homosexuality as a mental disorder in the DSM, since hey, like mental retardation see, it is a genetic condition. And I feel quite confident that homosexuals would not like this option.

Assuming that homosexuality is developed by genetic propensity and choice, then those parents who get genetic testing done and find out that the gene (or genes) that indicate genetic propensity, and assuming that the parents don't choose to abort there and then (assume at or greater than 90% given the history of other conditions), then they would do anything and everything possible to indoctrinate their children against homosexuality, since even those I know who are liberal hate the thought of having a homosexual child. I am guessing that homosexuals wouldn't like this option.

And the last option, that it is purely a matter of choice. I believe that no man is born perfect, that each is born with imperfections that they are charged to try to overcome. I served my country in peace and war, and along with my physical injuries (which were reasonably severe) also became afflicted with PTSD. I have found since I returned from my service in the Global War on Terror (I hate that term, but be that as it may), that I have become much more prone to irritability, hypervigilance, and have had many more violent thoughts then I did before my combat service. Now, yes, I am disabled, I do receive compensation from the military and the VA for it, but what I choose to do is precisely that, my choice alone. If I choose to give into my impulses, if I am too weak or lazy to control them, then I bear the sole responsibility for what I do.

And God did grant us free will, to do with our lives as we wish. He also has set standards for us to achieve to live in His grace. So yes, while everyone has a different place on the starting line, I do think the rules are the same for all of us. Now given this standard, it makes no difference to me which case is true, living as a homosexual is a choice that people make because, "oh I want to live true to myself". Not all our dreams can come true, we don't always get what we want. So even if people have biologically bases impulses for homosexual behavior (which I will concede is possible since I have not seen evidence to say it is not), to say that I must give into my impulses is stating that I am nothing more than an animal. God gave us choice and the capacity to reason, and that means we can (and should) choose not to give into our impulses and try to overcome them.

I'm British and as an outsider watching the Yes on 8 advertisements I felt that particularly with the insidious use of children, this had far more to do with fear and prejudice, than preserving the institution of marriage. (I'm honestly baffled how one person's marriage affects someone else's, but there you go).

But now you have discrimination enshrined in law whereby one section of the commnunity is denied something open to everyone else purely on the grounds that they are different. For those of you who voted yes, is that really the America you want? And where does that stop?

Change for the worse: As I said before, Hitler-based analogies indicate you don't have a legitimate counter-argument. See Godwin's Law:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_Law

i love the people who keep throwing out "you need a mother and father to raise a child."

oh really? then should single moms who've been left by deadbeat dads be persecuted? maybe all those black moms on welfare with 8 kids by 8 different dads should shut the eff up before passing judgement on whether two gay men would some how ruin a child by bringing it up in a home filled with love.

honestly, the anti-gay people have so many arguments...and yet none of them actually are valid. sanctity of marriage (oh, yeah, cuz people getting married/divorced and remarried really helps that argument), it takes a mother and a father to raise a child (hmm..yeah, sorry, that argument doesn't work unless you want to ban single parents) and my personal favorite, "god says it's evil" - unless you've had a conversation with this so-called god, who the christ are you to say what "he" thinks? the bible was written by a man. for all we know, it's a work of fiction. the bible says a whole shitload of things that no longer are relevant today - slaves, women's rights, etc, etc.

SERIOUSLY. how in the hell does it affect YOU personally if two gay men, or two gay women, want to get married? how? it's not. are "the gays" coming to your house, trying to "convert" you? doubtful. and as for the whole, "it's a choice" thing - IT'S NOT. just cuz you say it's a choice doesn't mean it is. did you choose to be black? did you choose to be male or female? holy christ, people. go read some books, get an education and stop being soooo ignorant. no wonder the rest of the world looks down upon America. we've got a bunch of crazy morons running around saying stupid things.

I agree with Alexandra.
You also forgot to mention another lame 'argument' from the prop8 campaigners...about teaching gay marriage at school.
Seriously...i went up to a master degree and never got any class about marriage and divorce.
Anyway..also very surprised that 70% of african americans voted to ban gay marriage...i would have thought that these black civil rights fights which led african americans to marry whomever they want regardless of race consideration would have inspired them...
it really looks like each group fights for its own interests...

Is there any link providing info on what's going to happen next ?

Third...and this is an honest question, not snarky...but can someone please explain the difference b/w domestic partnerships and being able to say you're "married" Is it just a semantic difference? Are there other benefits to marriage that DPs do not provide?

Posted by: Bruingrl68 | November 06, 2008 at 08:00 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

There are over 1000 differences, many of them financial and having to do with pensions, immigration, etc. They are real differences. When you vote to discriminate, well ... you vote to discriminate.

"The General Accounting Office in 1997 released a list of 1,049 benefits and protections available to heterosexual married couples. These benefits range from federal benefits, such as survivor benefits through Social Security, sick leave to care for ailing partner, tax breaks, veterans benefits and insurance breaks. They also include things like family discounts, obtaining family insurance through your employer, visiting your spouse in the hospital and making medical decisions if your partner is unable to. Civil Unions protect some of these rights, but not all of them. "


The election of Obama was bittersweet for me as a gay person. On one hand, he could have probably stopped prop 8 from passing if he through his weight behind supporting it since he surely would have had some influence with the African American voters. I wish that his presidential race did not coincide with prop 8! It's horrible that the rights of gays were trumped in the very same election that the first African American president was elected. Bittersweet irony.

Someone said that a gay white man would come ahead of them on the social ladder. And that may be true, but only if the gay white man was in the closet. I mean, when do you think we will have an openly gay president, ever?!?! The fact that gay people must stay in the closet to not be discriminated against is evidence that homophobia runs deep in our society. As does racism.

Although, I think people are naive if they think that the issue of gay marriage will go away now that people have voted on it twice. Just because a majority of people agree with something does not make it right. People aren't going to go quietly when you take away their rights. Eventually the bigots will realize that they only people affected by the same-sex marriage laws are same-sex couples. Eventually the bigots will get tired of fighting because in reality they have less to loose by same-sex marriage being legalized than same-sex couples have to gain. People argue that the entire foundation of society will be ruined if same-sex marriage is legalized. But that won't happen, it's really just about the rights of same sex people. It might be bad news for people who have to feel like they are superior to others, but society will continue on a little bit fairer than it was before.

Years ago, one of the founders of GLAAD said that to gain political clout, gays had to increase their numbers. He further said that since the percentage of gays in any population has historically remained the same, he felt that recruiting was the only option. He mentioned children, but said that any parent knows how malleable young children are and would probably be less inclined to support gay rights if children were targeted in that way.

Gay marriage became the answer to that problem. If it is legal, there will be no legal way to stop the teaching of it to children. It will be said that it is being taught under the guise of tolerance, but how can you not then teach the sexual component when that is what defines homosexuality.

Think about it. They are already reading The Tale of Two Princes to second-graders in Massachusetts. Does anyone remember reading heterosexual fairy tale love stories in grade school? Of course not. That was what you read at home, not school.

Grade school children should be free to grow up without anyone influencing their sexuality. Let them freely become what they will become. If there was a provision to keep any discussion of homosexual or other sexual issues out of elementary schools, I might change my mind about opposing gay marriage.

Several years ago, a teacher at my son's school decided to show a small group of ten-year-old boys a movie in which high school boys were kissing each other and cross-dressing. It turned out that the teacher was a gay activist who subsequently refused to see the inappropriateness in what he did, saying instead that it was a lesson about tolerance.

I am sorry to say that that incident made me rethink my feelings about gays, and it was that incident which led me to do the research through which I discovered the aforementioned statements made by the GLAAD founder.

There's plenty of time to teach about tolerance and sexuality once children have entered adolescence. For some reason, this is not good enough for the gay community. You might want to ask yourself why.

 
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