Yes on Prop. 8 gaining ground, thanks to Inland support

The latest Field Poll in California shows what a lot of people expected: That the battle over Proposition 8 is going to be a nail-biter. From the Sacramento Bee:

Over the past six weeks, a proposed constitutional amendment that would end same-sex marriage in California has gained substantial ground but still trails by a five-point margin heading into Tuesday's election. A new Field Poll shows Proposition 8, one of the most closely watched state ballot measures in years, is supported by 44 percent of likely voters. Forty-nine percent oppose it, and 7 percent are undecided. In the last Field Poll, released Sept. 18, the measure was behind by 17 points.

Once again, note the inland/coastal divide: "Geography is also playing an important role. Voters who live in coastal California counties constitute 71 percent of likely voters, and they oppose the measure by a 54-39 margin, according to the poll. Those who live in inland counties back it by a 57-37 margin."

Few have more to potentially lose than San Francisco Mayor Gavin Newsom. From the Chronicle: "The mayor is hosting a private fundraiser at his Russian Hill home tonight and has already picked up $125,000 in contributions from those attending the event. This afternoon, he's holding a forum with employees at Google, and over the next several days he'll be hitting nearly every major Bay Area radio station and staging rallies around the city. Newsom says he owes it to his constituents in San Francisco to do everything in his power to fight the initiative. But political analysts note that the outcome of Tuesday's election could weigh heavily on Newsom's future in politics, and specifically his potential bid for governor."

-- Shelby Grad

Photo: LAT file

Comments

[John Stafford]

WHY ISN'T THIS HEADLINE "NO ON 8 HOLDS 5 POINT LEAD GOING INTO FINAL WEEKEND" or "CALIFORNIANS APPEAR READY TO REJECT PROP 8"

[Mark]

Could be due to bias.

[anon]

Actually by implying that Prop 8 might win the article inspires opponents to redouble their efforts, while lulling supporters into a false sense of security.
This is more like a rally cry to keep opponents of prop 8 from quitting before the race has ended. Even the picture included with the head line supports this argument.
Think a little while longer before posting.

[Colin Gallagher]

Honestly a five point lead is not that much if most Democrats in California don't show up at the polls on Tuesday because of the presidential race being a foregone conclusion. I hope and pray that Proposition 8 is defeated next week. But the no on 8 side should not be complacent, especially as this single issue has galvanized the religious right in a way that the McCain campaign ever could.

[Yes eight]

Some of us aren't religious fanatics and just believe that marriage should stay the way it has always been. I saw that 20/20 article (I think it's on YouTube) and I don't want my kids growing up being tod that its natural and right. It's very destructive. All Americans have way more rights than most of the world but there is a time when it goes too far. An earlier posting said it correctly, extreme political correctness has gone way to far. Try being Gay in the midle east for a while and you will appreciate the liberties aforded to you in the US. Just don't push your gay agenda on me and my family. ... MORE >

[Phillip Reed]

Great!!! GO PROP 8, GO!!! I'm tired of having the radical gay agenda shoved down my throat. Marriage has always and should ALWAYS be between a man and woman!!!!! IT IS WHAT IT IS!!!

[Creator God]

Allowing gay marriage is yet another sin that weakens our families and our country. It's time to stand up for our holy unions of man and women, not only by passing prop 8, but also by educating people about how God wants us to treat our spouses, our children, and our parents. Is it really all about sex in this country? Really? Are we just animals? Or are we made in the image of God? I believe we were made in the image of God. God have mercy on us, bring forth your people, YES on prop 8! Amen.

God please forgive all of us of our sins!

[n. reed]

I could careless what people do sexually behind closed doors. I have a problem when you open the doors and teach it to our children. Our kids our going to learn about homosexuality and heterosexuality as they mature. I do not want the schools teaching that it is acceptable or not for people of the same sex to marry. The teacher's Union might say they want no on prop 8 but every teacher I meet wants to prop 8 to pass and would prefer the union not to spend their fees on any candidate. In the end, schools will suffer. My daughter has already told me of a number of classmates that will be leaving public schooling and entering into private if prop 8 passes. That will be money the school system will not be getting.

[Teneil]

I hope Gavin Newsom and his 4 SF judge friends who thought they could overturn the vote of the people go home crying on Tuesday when Prop 8 passes. Kiss that seat in the governor's office goodbye, Gavin!

[Jason]

That dude needs to buckle his belt. Embarrassing.

[Alan]

Altering the California Flag ... you just lost my vote.

I am not sure if this was the Yes on 8 Group or the No on 8 Group. However, from the pictured representatives this is the No on 8.

VOTE YES on 8!

[AlexT]

Just a couple of reasons why I will vote YES on 8:

"The larger empirical literature on child well-being suggests that the two sexes bring different talents to the parenting enterprise, and that children benefit from growing up with both their biological parents. This strongly suggests that children reared by same-sex parents will experience greater difficulties with their identity, sexuality, attachments to kin, and marital prospects as adults, among other things." (From the "Ten Principles on Marriage and the Public Good")

"What, though, can be a greater benefit to children and young people than growing up with their mother and father married to each other in a low-conflict relationship? We need to be supporting and strengthening the institution of marriage for the sake of children, not redefining and weakening it." (Salvatore Cordileone, auxiliary bishop of the San Diego diocese)

My vote is for YES on Prop 8

http://yes-on-prop8.blogspot.com/

.

[Sann]

I studied this issue before I decided to vote YES on prop 8. I wanted to be sure that I had the facts and didn't want to be at the mercy of television ads. After realizing that I would be giving the gay community a word (no additional rights at all) and that the trade would be that the remainder of the community would give up basic freedoms, I knew that this wasn't right. Democracy isn't about taking rights from some and giving to others.

I stood at a street corner holding a "YES on PROP 8" sign and understood quickly the caliber of people we are up against. While they claim intolerance against them, they were throwing things, yelling obscenities, flipping me off, etc. They are the ones full of hate. They actually threw a drink at an old woman who is wheelchair bound! No way, right? My daughter's car (which has a YES on PROP 8 bumper sticker on it) has been vandalized twice. The sign in our yard and well as our neighbors has been stolen and other signs the next street over from us have been slashed with knives. I am more resolved than ever!! Let our vote reflect true democracy - vote YES on PROP 8.

[chaz]

Yeah... and since we're passing Prop 8, let's make blacks 2/3's human beings again and outlaw interracial marriage.

I mean.... while we're at it, let's just define marriage as between two people white, straight people approve of.

[Myrna]

VOTE YES ON PROPOSITION 8!

[True American]

im sick of all these fools posting on here like children at a football game.
its not about winning or losing. the only thing we could lose is our rights as americans. gay or straight. i think the biggest problem here is all the propaganda that you people eat.. they scared you into thinking that your children could possibly be gay and that got to you.
you children will thank you when they cant marry they're loves because you were so ignorant and nieve.

[Just this guy]

A vote for Yes is a vote for the utah mormon agenda. Do you really want encroaching mormon agenda shoved down your throat? Not me! mormons are bigots, mormons wear weird underwear, they don't drink coffee, and want to run your life. Remember that when you go to the polls.

[Kevin Bellenfant]

I have never seen so much hatred and vile as I have seen coming from the anti 8 supporters. All I see from them on every ad, and blog is name calling and personal animosity towards the Prop 8 supporters. This is very, very, one sided.

Personally, I say live and let live, but I don't think that most gays share the same attitude. What I see is a minority group with an agenda that wants to force their view on everyone else. I also have seen that there is actually more out of state funds coming from the no people than the yes side, (much more). Again, just an example of a minority trying to force their views on the majority.

What gets lost here is that there is no fundamental right for gays to marry. This is something that was artificially created very recently through the Liberal California Supreme Court. In fact, there is a federal law which requires that the federal government does not recognize any marriages not between a man and a woman. How can this be a "fundamental right", if there is a federal law against it.

Prop 22 won, and so will Prop 8. How many times will the will of the people be ignored?

Kevin Bellenfant

[Toby - Right for Society]

Sometimes people need to be willing to set aside there personal interests to do what's right for society as a whole. The traditonal family has been the foundation of socieity for 6,000 years of recorded history. We should do everything we can to strengthen marriage which is beneficial to a strong society. Take one look at the social problems of San Francisco and you'll see what happens when the traditional family breaks down, more crime, more disease, more abuse, less children living with their parents, etc, etc,! Is this what we want for our entire state?

Protect the children, Yes on Prop 8!

[Darren Shupe]

I have to admit that I'm puzzled as to exactly whose "rights" are being taken away by the extension of civil marriage to same-sex couples. Everyone has a right to his or her religious beliefs, no matter how bizarre, as long as they don't infringe upon the freedom of thought and action of others. It's fine if a particular church doesn't choose to sanction same-sex marriages, but when religion seeks to extend that prohibition into the public realm and enshrine it in law, that's when it needs to be remembered that religion is a matter of personal conscience and that law, as in the Lemon test, should neither advance nor inhibit it.

[john]

MAY GAVIN NEWSOM AND THE REST OF THE SODOMITES RECEIVE THEIR JUST REWARD IN THE JUDGEMENT! AMEN.

[Michael]

The Religious Right (oxymoron if I ever heard one) thinks they can shove their agenda down everybody's throat. I don't want to live by your Christianity. As for the 4 SF (read liberal) judge friends...three of the 4 were Republican appointees. Did you know the Chief Justice who wrote the opinion has been appointed to various offices in the judicial branch by Ronald Reagan, George Deukmejian, and Pete Wilson? So much for radical liberal judges taking away the vote of the people. Sorry...but the vote was unconstitutional. A majority doesn't always make right.

[Freedom Eagle]

God loves pro-8 bigots too

[Proudmama]

As a Christian and a mother of two young children, I find myself ashamed of and saddened by the intolerance of those voting YES on Prop 8. I believe that two people who want to commit to each other for eternity should be welcomed and celebrated by Christians and all others, not rejected as "sinners". Didn't Jesus ask us not to cast stones? Shame on you. Prop 8 is deeply discriminatory, un-American and, I believe, un-Christian.

I will continue to teach my children that ALL committed human love is a reflection of God's love.

And I will continue to pray that the agents of intolerance who vote yes on Prop 8 are overcome by kinder, wiser California voters tomorrow.

NO ON PROP 8.

[Branson Missouri]

This is the race to watch, the impact wide reaching.

[jay]

i am a man who married my husband on 6.17.08. prior to that we were registered domestic partners for four years. i can tell you that the social support we have received since we married is remarkable. now i understand the meaning of separate but equal is never equal -people, including our parents, treat us even better than they did before. all i want to do is live a long, monogamous life with my husband. no one who truly supports family values should have an issue with that. the la times debunked the myths regarding lost church tax exemptions and gay marriage being taught in schools; please vote no on prop 8 and let's put our energies instead into fixing the state of our nation.

[Greg]

VOTE NO ON 8! I hope Prop. 8 doesn't pass.

[Nonzealot]

PLEASE!!! If you want the laws of your country dictated by religion, move to Iran or Saudi Arabia. Which religion do we want used here? The Mormons? Judaism?, Catholicism? Islam? Be careful what you wish for.

I don't excuse the bad behavior of proponents or opponents of this issue, but try to imagine if someone was trying to take your rights away. I'm sure you would be very emotional about it.

All this stuff about children and teachiing things in school have absolutely nothing to do with Proposition 8, and are only being used to hide the ugliness of your true bigotry. You're still welcome to all of your religious beliefs, you just can't use them as a reason to discriminate against others in a free society.

No one is going to stop you from teaching your children to discriminate and judge others. I'm sure they'll thank you for it.

If you can say that gay marriage will weaken our families and our country, then I can say that gay marriage will lead to the end of terrorism.

Both are unfounded assertions. If you don't have to defend your ridiculous assertions, then why should I have to defend mine?

No one is asking you to change your life or your beliefs in any way. If there are gay people in your community, it doesn't affect you in any way whether they are married or not. Nothing changes as far as you are concerned.

This is why after hearing the best arguments from both sides, the California Supreme Court ruled that there was no rational basis to deny the right to marry to law abiding, tax paying sames sex couples.

[Barack Me Amadeus]

Prop 8 promotes ignorance, intolerance, inequality and discrimination. No one here has the right to deny rights of others. One of the posts said that gays should be happy they have the rights they do in America because it would be much worse for them in another country. Thankfully, that has no bearing on this argument because the fact is, we ARE in America and gays are just as much Americans as any of you "traditional" marriage advocates.

Let me ask you, have you or any of your family members ever been divorced? If not, then you certainly have loved ones that have been divorced. Do you deny them the right to marry a second time because they've dishonored or marred the supposed sanctity of marriage? NO. Do you try to pass legislation and impose restrictions on their right to enter into a pact of lifelong companionship in marriage because their circumstances didn't quite align with your ideal image of marriage? If anything, gay people will REINSTATE the sanctity of marriage because they actually APPRECIATE it as a sacred honor, while about half of heterosexuals do not, based on divorce statistics.

For those of you who have witnessed No on 8 defenders lashing out, or you've had signs stolen, or you've been flipped off, maybe you should consider that you're inciting this behavior with your unbelievably offensive and oppressive initiative. Your actions, your words, your intolerance is OFFENSIVE. I'm a married heterosexual, and this initiative infuriates me. I can only imagine what I would be compelled to do in response to your audacious actions if I were gay.

This is a CIVIL RIGHTS issue. You are teaching your children intolerance and hate. You don't have to teach your kids about homosexuality, and the schools certainly do not have to. Just leave it to the first gay kid in their class to make them aware that homosexuality exists... maybe your child will be confused or maybe they'll lash out at them like you do through Prop 8. Either way, we all lose.

[Hunter]

Can we take a deep breath? Most gay people don't want to be married in the religious way (at least not any that I know of). They want to be married in the sense that they get spousal benefits. All this religious objection, and I can see their point, since marriage is one of the sacraments. But the clencher is, somewhere in our past, someone started passing laws and issuing rights based on that sacrament. That leaves people who can't or won't get married in the cold, and THAT is what is unfair about passing prop 8.

[Dave Albulario]

California, FREEDOM says NO on Prop 8! Here's why...

Some churches already perform gay marriages. Prop 8 would stop that, effectively making the decision that each church must make on its own. PROP 8 OPPOSES RELIGIOUS FREEDOM, and THAT is UNDENIABLY WRONG. The law is currently in favor of gay marriage in the state of California. That law affects, in a positive way, the lives of gay Californians. It simply DOESN'T affect straight Californians. There is no reason for straight people to oppose gay marriage, because it doesn't affect their lives.

Gay marriage is good. It edifies the lives of a group of people who have been mocked and oppressed and persecuted and harassed and assaulted and maimed and killed; especially in much of middle America. The California Supreme Court understands how important it is to lift these people up, and confirm and celebrate their quest for "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." Gay Californians (and eventually ALL gay Americans) MUST be given the RIGHT to marriage.

Whatever your religious persuasion, in the eyes of the State of California, Marriage IS a RIGHT! Straight people have always had the right to choose to marry. It IS their right! Gay people MUST now be granted THE SAME right. To do otherwise is a slap in the face to gay and lesbian people.

Prop 8 effectively tells our friends who happen to be gay, that we don't believe they are worthy of marriage. Prop 8 tells our family members who happen to be gay, that they are inferior to straight people, and that if they got rid of their "gayness" they would be better off. Prop 8 tells our gay brothers & sisters, that they can have their "Civil Unions" and "Domestic Partnerships", but I'm sorry, you can't be part of the popular kids in the "Marriage Club." That's only for those of us who are good enough, and since you're gay, you're just not good enough. In our State of California, you can have ALL the rights you want, EXCEPT marriage. Marriage is just for the popular kids, and since you've spent your life being called "fag" or "dike", you're just not good enough to be in our click.

ENOUGH ALREADY with the elitist BULL****! Let people freaking live their lives! I'm sorry straight folks, but this is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS! Be ACTUALLY supportive of the gay people in your life. Enough with the "I love my gay friends" CRAP! If you pass Prop 8, you are telling your gay friends and family that their struggles are not important! You are calling them INFERIOR to straight people. You are saying that their LOVE isn't nearly as good as yours! Enough already! VOTE NO ON PROP 8!

PROP 8 = PROP HATE!

[Tammie]

This is not a direct democracy. Civil rights should never be up for a popular vote or established by the will of the people. Our founding fathers drafted a constitution to prevent this and also be able to recify this if it happens. Did you all not take civics/government? Because if you don't understand how our government works, then you cannot possibly understand what makes this nation great. Remember that our constitution protects us all, and supreme court justices have overturned segregation and other horrible laws enacted by the will of the people to protect al its citizens, no matter what you think of them. It doesn't matter if you hate gays or not, we are all supposed to stand up for each other's rights. Otherwise, we are no different from the Taliban or other extremist political groups who want to take away rights because they believe someone doesn't deserves it based on religion, "how things have always been", "tradition", etc. The whole world is watching us, and they think we've become a bunch of uneducated backward cowboys, who don't appreciate or know what we have here and are now trying to take it away from each other. How embarassing. All my family members, Republican and Democrat, young and old, whether they agree with same-sex marriage or not, are voting NO.

[shayna cardillo]

Lets remember God never preaches hate or intolerance. But marriage is his divine institution, lets keep it between a man and a women as it was intended. Gay americans have domestic patnership rights,so i dont really see what the big deal is. Protect the sanctity of marriage and vote yes on 8.

[Devon]

It is not our GOD given right to pass judgment on others. It is not our GOD given right to decide anything for anyone other than ourselves. It is our HUMAN right to be be treated equally. ALL of us. Everyone has the power to teach their children their own values. And from the way most parents are allowing their children to dress and behave, I would say there are bigger lessons on family values that most of this country should be spending their time worrying about. Being educated about a thing does not MAKE you that thing. Stop making this issue about the children and start acknowledging that it's simply about FEAR. And any decision made out of FEAR is the wrong one.

[Anthony]

Errr, no...marriage, according to the state is not divine, if that were the case, when you get a divorce (clearly something which is forbidden in Biblical writings) you stand before a judge wearing robes, NOT a cleric wearing vestments.

One day people will realize that those promoting inequality had succumbed to arrogance and bigotry.

No on 8.

[Pat]

So Prop 8 passed. Battle not over, yet.

Yep I voted yes. But I see eventually gay marriage will be legalized. Why? The Bible said we will all eventually screw up, and then God's Kingdom comes. I believe God; I believe the teaching of the Bible. So it is my duty to vote yes.