Fight against Prop. 8 reaches East L.A.

The fight against Proposition 8, a state initiative to ban gay marriage, arrived today in East Los Angeles, where a trio of local politicians launched their push to reach Latino residents -– frequently a more socially conservative slice of the electorate -- on the hot-button issue.

Los Angeles County Supervisor Gloria Molina, Los Angeles Board of Education President Monica Garcia and state Assembly candidate John Perez opened the Cesar Chavez Avenue storefront office for the “No on 8” campaign, which will communicate with Latino voters across the state.

Perez -- who is Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa’s cousin and a shoo-in for the seat currently held by Assemblyman Fabian Nunez – implored the crowd to write checks to the campaign and tell their neighbors to fight the measure. “Proposition 8 is a horrible, insidious message to the community that we’re worth less than others,” said Perez, who is openly gay.

Garcia told the audience that the measure would harm her loved ones, including her lesbian sister, Lilia Garcia, and her sister’s partner, Kelley Brower – both of whom stood with her and her mother in front of a bank of television cameras. “Familia is familia,” the school board president declared.

--David Zahniser

Comments

[Mahonri]

This type of "marriage" is not something to be encouraged at all. They hide because the very behavior is shameful. No amount of excuses makes it right. Thomas Monson, Prophet, Seer and Revelator and Presiding President of the Church of JESUS CHRIST of Latter Day Saints is the only man on the Earth authorized to receive Gods true word and he says to stop this farce of 'marriage' of same sex couples. God has spoken. All who will not pay heed to the message will fail even as they seem to succeed in the short run. All other Churches are of Satan and only Pres. Monson is Gods representative on Earth, presiding over the one true Church. Listen to him and save yourselves from grief in supporting filth and degredation.

[Justin Doerr]

Mahonri... This is exactly why I do not like Mormons. You guys actually believe that some moron actually talks to the creator of the universe... If that's the case then why doesn't he call the press or the mass media conglomerates. You are crazy and I am going to whatever it takes to prove to people in California through my volunteer efforts to PROVE how crazy you are. You are not going to decide my fate. You don't KNOW God. You are being brainwashed to a cultish creepy psycho religion that the only reason why you guys are in Utah, is because we want you guys to be in a remote as possible place so that we don't have to associate with the likes of you. Vote NO on Prop 8, so we can not give this mor(m)on the benefit of the doubt. I really hope this doesn't get deleted because hey... I don't choose to be gay... however I do have a choice in not being brainwashed.

[Jeff Kelly]

Thought I would share an opinion about title 8 and what I believe. As raised as a Christian I believe that marriage is between and man and a woman. We read in the Holy Bible that marriage is a special and sacred thing not an obsolete ceremony. I do support title 8 and believe that the family needs to be protected and for the sake of all the young people in California and the United States I believe we should all support title 8. Please consider the impact that not supporting title 8 will have on the future of the upbringing of the next generation.

[Just a dude]

No one saying you have to accept it within your religion. By the same token, you shouldn't demand that the rest of society accept your religious doctrine unwillingly, particularly when society is diverse and not everyone believes what you do.

I do not believe that gay mariage is harmful--MA has had gay mariage going for awhile now, and "traditional marriage" is still alive and kicking; I don't think I've read about any complaints of it "going away" or being impacted by a gay marriage ceremony. And as long as gay marriage doesn't hurt anyone, our government should grant equal opportunity to all regardless of what we believe. Society is diverse, we value our nation on its principle of equal opportunity, yet we seem content to demonize a minority facet in our society; almost in the same vein as Hitler did in Germany.

As a fellow Christian, I think you missed one of the most fundamental messages of Christianity, which is to be non-judgemental to your fellow human beings. Instead, you feel authorized to pass judgment. How can you promote your religion, convince people that your way is the way, if you do not offer them the freedom and very liberties that you have to choose what is right for them? Shame on you.

[liltortillagirl]

God bless America, for we have the freedom and liberty to live without fear of tyrants like these people trying to run our lives through what they believe is correct.

No one loses anything if same sex marriages remain legalized in California. Of all things, the economy will see a boost because of the revenue created by two consenting adults getting married. Love is love and i believe religion should not run the rights of Americans. Equality does not only apply to a certain group or kind of person. We Americans have a duty to stand up for what is right and this kind of bigotry will only hurt us in the long run.

Vote no on prop 8 and God bless<3

[Mr.G...]

YES,YES,YES ON PROP. 8

[Adam]

Mahonri is clearly only PRETENDING to be Mormon and to speak for Mormons. Excepting anyone with clinical mental disorders, no Mormon would ever write the garbage that he wrote here about other churches being of Satan.

[Calvin B]

I dont understand why people have to lie about stuff! I mean I've seen the ads on tv and heard them on the radio but they are all lies!

PROP 8 has nothing to do with Schools..... (This is a Scare Tactic)
Prop 8 has nothing to do with Church at all....................
Prop 8 doesn't force beliefs on you at all......

It's very ironic to me to see so many church goers and right wing fundamentalist say how sinful it is and how they disagree!

BUT....isnt it a SIN to LIE!

I mean no matter how you feel about this, no matter what excuses and lies and scare tactics you come up with.....Right is Right! and Wrong is Wrong!

What if your rights were up for vote?

Think about that!

[Arturo]

Mahonri, you are obviously not LDS. If you were, your comment wouldn't be so mean spirited, and if you are Mormon and for prop 8 you would have been at the broadcast last night where the General Authorities spoke of being loving and open to the gay community as we always have been. Not accepting of certain actions, and standing up for Gos design of Marriage, but nontheless loving.
You shouldn't pretend to be LDS just to get others against the church. Anyone who knows members of our church is aware of our position, the way we go about it, and how to treat others appropriately.
Yes on Prop 8.

[Timothy]

Arturo,

The "way you go about it" is deceptively and dishonestly.

Your church hides the fact that they are providing the bulk of the funding and almost all of the volunteers for this proposition. The folks knocking on doors do not identify themselves as Mormons and the Church won't give a contribution under its name, only instructing the members that they must. (And because it comes from the Prophet, they do to the tune of tens of millions of dollars).

And they lie.

For example, rather than tell the public that the face of the campaign, law professor Richard Petersen, is Mormon, they try to emphasize that he's at Pepperdine, a protestant Christian college. Totally dishonest.

And the claims he makes - as a law professor - are disputed by every newspaper or other legal group as being completely baseless and nothing but a scare tactic. Totally dishonest.

The Mormons I know are decent and good people. I feel terribly sad that their Church and its leaders have adopted such a morally dispicable practice of lying and deceiving. It must be so very jarring for them.

[Caitlin A]

What ever happened to seperation of church and state? I don't care what ANY religion says about same sex marriage- religion has NO place in public policy.

[Kathryn]

As a Christian, I believe that marriage between a man and woman is ordained of God. That union is a sacred institution in our society and should be recognized in no other way.

I love homosexuals, but this does not mean that I love the way they live. To accept and love a person does not mean that I have to accept and love their actions. I choose to stand up for what I believe in and this is why I believe in Proposition 8.

[Nicolas D.]

What is all the fuss about? As a gay man, I don't understand why we're fighting so hard to have our legal partnerships referred to as something as archaic and traditional as "marriage". I say let them have their term; we can do better than that! I'm not saying I'm in favor of our civil unions being referred to "domestic partnerships" mind you. But I do think that we can come up with our own term to define our unions.
I heard someone say that redefining marriage is like trying to redefine a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. To make a PB & J you put PB on one slice of bread and jelly on the other. Then someone comes along and says, "I don't like jelly! I want PB on both slices of bread - but I still want you to call it a peanut butter and jelly sandwich!" That seems ridiculous to me; It's a different sandwich and needs it's own name!
I for one am going to vote yes on prop. 8.

[Bess]

Mahonri, where did you get that kind of idea? I'm not a Mormon, but I got a lot of friends who are. And what you are saying is the opposite of what I know and heard. Are you really a Mormon? Talk about the issue. Mormons are not the issue here.

[LDS]

To Timothy-The Mormons are very clear about the fact that they are behind Proposition 8 100%-and it's not just because it goes against everything we believe in. Did you know that right now, the LDS Church is being sued in the State of California for refusing to perform same-sex marriages? What message does that send? That we must compromise our beliefs and give up our constitutionally protected right of freedom of religion? Caitlin, I agree that religion has no place in public policy. So why is the government trying to force their way into a church's policies? To me, that's worse than trying to protect the sanctity of marriage, that's basically throwing the constitution of the United States out of the window.

And yes, Mahonri's comment was uncalled for. We don't believe all other churches are of Satan. We as a church practice love and tolerance for all walks of life, and have often opened our hearts and our pocketbooks to help people of other faiths. However, we hold to high standards for those who choose to be members of our church, and because of that, we are being persecuted.

[Chris N]

Proposition 8 is wrong on so many levels. People are judging it based on morality and religious beliefs while both of them have nothing to do with it. That's no different than voting for a president based on who loves GOD more rather than who's more qualified for the job.

There's a reason why the Constitution clearly separates Religion from State. I think the main problem is that people view same sex marriage the same as a traditional "religious" marriage, which are two completely different matters. Being married by the state and by the church are NOT the same thing. Churches are private institutions and they can believe whatever they want, but the MAIN issue here is that these people want to get rid of the right to marry under the STATE. This in itself is targeting a group on people and taking their rights away. Religious or not, this proposition makes no sense and makes the Constitution seem like a joke.

People are complaining saying that the Government is going to tax churches and children are going to be FORCED to learn about gay sex when all of these are nothing but lies. What kind of place do these people live in? There's no way the State would allow such things to happen because they are AGAINST THE LAW.

I can't believe that an institution basing their whole society on love, honesty, justice, and tolerance don't see the irony of accusing others of being immoral and lying about them to try and brainwash people into believing that what they're doing is all right. Shame on you!

[kevin]

How is it a lie that it will not affect schools and what kids are taught? what about the kids in san fransisco that were taken out of school one friday for a school sponsored field trip to a lesbian wedding because it was an "educational experience." what about in massachusettes where gay marraige is legal and forceably taught in schools? By allowing gay marraige, it is like getting the foot in the door, next it is the leg, and then the body and then the head. Before you know it they will be making all of the laws! Keep the institution of marraige the same as it has been for centuries - between a man and a woman. Gay people, you are God's children just like the rest of us, and we love you. Just don't call it a peanut butter and jelly sandwich just like the gay person earlier said.

[Paul]

Ok, so if you support prop 8 and believe in the sanctity of marriage....Will you also support a measure to ban divorce? Or a measure banning male-female couples from marrying who cannot have children? Just curious.

[Don't Disenfranchise Gay Children]

Kevin - think about the kids that are gay and are being taught that being gay is not socially acceptable if NO ON 8 passes. What message does this send? Do you know how many gay children run away or commit suicide because they are not accepted by their peers or their parents? The streets of L.A. are littered with them. What message does this referendum send to these disenfranchised children? Certainly not a message of love. Maybe this is what you want to happen to these kids. Maybe you want them to grow up on the streets because you are afraid of them sitting in the classroom next to your children. THINK ABOUT IT. THIS IS A HATEFUL REFERENDUM. The ads the NO ON 8 opposition is running about schools and what kids are taught are shameful. These ads are designed to scare parents and disenfranchise children who identify as gay. What a sad day for California it will be.

[Mageos]

Paul, the I support prop 8 because it maintains the standard of marriage as defined between a man and a women. I admit that divorce rates are way too high and that there are those that do marry who cannot or do not wish to have kids. Defining marriage as between man and a women sets the standard that marriages should aim for. I admit that there are probably many homosexual couples that would make great parents, but that doesn't mean that it is the ideal social norm. A yes on prop 8 keeps the social standard set at between a man and a woman. The strength of a nation and society is only as strong as its families. The strongest families are those founded in the loving marriage of a man and a women. All relationships will not live up to this ideal, but we should not change the standard to accommodate.

[Mageos]

"think about the kids that are gay and are being taught that being gay is not socially acceptable if NO ON 8 passes."

Prop 8 will not teach kids that being gay is not socially acceptable but will teach children that marriage is between a man and a women. Most schools all ready teach that it is wrong to hate people based on sexuality, race, gender or religion. Those will still be taught with or without prop 8, as they should. Prop 8 ONLY changes the definition of marriage. If you are not happy with the way domestic partnership rights are being administrated, fight for that, but don't force me to change my definition of marriage.

[Rosie]

If you want to argue and say that everyone should vote yes on 8, then you are going against what this country has stood on as a foundation from the beginning: separation of church and state. Most people who argue for prop 8 are doing so because of religious reasons. Religion SHOULD NOT get in the way of government. How would you like it if someone outside your religion proposes a law that would intertwine that religious perspective with government? It doesn't work to let this happen.

Prop 8 purposefully excuses a large group of Americans from having a right that others are granted. Go do some research and you will learn that doctors confirm homosexuality is not a choice. This is something written in a gay person's genes. I didn't wake up one day and decide to be bisexual. I discovered this part of me as naturally as a young child discovers their feelings for the opposite sex. God makes some people that way. So why should they not have the same rights as a person that God created to be straight? Regardless of what happens with prop 8 for this election, in the near future, something like prop 8 will be looked upon as an embarrassment and will be overturned, just like discriminating laws against blacks and women have been in the past.

[Dr. Frank Patti]

PUBLIC DISPLAY OF BIGOTRY
It is a beautiful Saturday afternoon in South Orange County. Traveling South on the Coast Highway through Laguna Beach, my partner and I encountered a gaggle of YES ON EIGHT activists at Coast Highway and Crown Valley. It's easy to understand why someone with all of the privileges of marriage could miss the importance of Proposition Eight. If Prop 8 passes, this will be a time in history when a constitutional amendment will limit the civil rights of an entire group of people. Now, admittedly, half of the YES on 8 money is coming from members of the Mormon church in Utah. I would assume there would be a huge public outrage if someone were trying to pass a constitutional amendment that made a second or third or even fourth re-marriage illegal. What if those who have loved and lost were told, "well, you can have a civil ceremony, but you can't call it marriage and you can't file jointly on your federal income tax." Some 40 years ago inter racial couples weren't allowed to get married. So, Richard Ramirez, Scott Petersen, O.J. Simpson, the Menendez Brothers, and Robert Blake are all allowed to get married - as long as they don't marry one another.
Gay men and lesbians are your neighbors, co-workers, fellow church members and relatives. We get invited to your weddings and bridal showers. Some of us design your wedding gown, your wedding cakes, or wedding invitations. Some of us take your wedding pictures. Many of us cater your blessed first, second, third, or fourth wedding parties. We play the organ as you worship your God on Sunday mornings. And, some of us just smile politely as you pass around the pictures from your weddings and give an obligatory affirmation of how beautiful the bride looks. We are your sons and daughters. And if we want to spend our life with the same sex person we love, how is it that anyone has the self-imposed authority to try to stop us?

[Mageos]

For the record, only 21% of Yes on Prop 8's donations have come from out of state. No on Prop 8 has recieved a much higher proportion of their money (36%) from outside California. To say that it is funded by Mormons in Utah is not at all accurate.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-moneymap,0,2198220.htmlstory

[suegibson]

from a "genepool mormon" another example of arrogance on behalf of the mormons! they preach about free agency, but try expressing it and wow! free agency to mormons is an oxymoron! thinking and agreeing with what mormons believe are too very different things - believe me, I know!

[Augie Alvarez]

Has anybody ever stood next to a true friend when their soul mate has died and the family of the deceased not allowed them to even attend the funeral? Or when the family takes possession of their home and belongings stating that the partner has no legal rights to stay in the home that they've made together? Or even worse, when children are pulled from the home by the next of kin because the partner doesn't have legal joint custody?

[aprille]

proposition 8 is defining marriage, and if some couple were so in love they should go out of california to marry, if their love is strong enough,
yes i am under 18, however i belive that proposition 8 is protecting my right to freedom of religion.
and whoever says that propositiion 8 has nothing to do with education(calvin b.)
get your facts straight
my THREE year old sister was taught about same sex marraige, for gosh sakes shes three.
As a christian i love the person, not the sin. Stop bagging on people if you dont know anything about them.

if you still dont believe it...... go to protectmarriage.com
get your facts straight first, and rethink the propostion.

[Brad O.]

Why doesn't the L.A. Times ever cover the YES on 8 fight?? Then I get surprised telemarketers wondering why I refuse to subscribe. The L.A. times is so slanted it is ridiculous. L.A. Times: Report both sides of the story equally. Taking political positions on the issues is not news.

[kvan]

I don't care what anyone has to say about PROP 8. I'm voting YES because it is wrong. This is how you know we are in the last days. Evil has become good and Good has been defined as evil. Since the earth was created marriage has been between a man & a woman only, why should we change it now??? IT has always been this way. Prop 8 does NOT take away any rights from gay couples. They can live & do as they please.

I'm not trying to be judgmental because I have family & friends who are gay & just because I'm VOTING YES on 8, that doesn't mean that I love them any less. I still love them, but I just don't agree with their decision. This is my belief & I will stand up for what I know is right. As an American, I have freedom of speech, freedom of RELIGION & I will not let anyone change that!!

CALIFORNIANS: VOTE YES on PROP 8!!!!!!

[josh]

Kvan-

You sound very confused. "Good has become bad and bad has become good...we are in the last days"

That sounds like insanity to a non-christian. You sound like a schizophrenic. All that last day stuff is old propaganda. I dont think its meant to be taken literally. However, if there are bombs dropping over your head or an earthquake under your feet, it might seem like the last days, and it might be your last day on earth, but that doesnt prove or disprove anything from the bible.

Just try to pretend that a gay guy is the same as an ugly woman whose genitalia has become inflamed due to a disease, and her partner has a fetish for that. Women and men are always switching roles mentally anyways. Actually, the whole world is already gay if you think about it.

[NK]

I think Proposition 8 should be fought down with a winning "no". Ads that claim "yes" on 8 are full of bogus lies that are bought by mindless members of society. Proposition 8 absolutely WILL take away the rights of many Californians who choose to lead a gay or lesbian lifestyle if voted "yes". It also will NOT shut down churches or force students to be taught about gay marriage in schools! And no matter what the outcome of this proposition is, there will still be gays and lesbians in society anyway. I hope everyone who votes "yes" on 8 will have gay and lesbian family members so they can see how hard it is for them in society.

[Prop 8 Over the Top]

I think I've read the money fighting for and against prop 8 is now reaching 60M and is the most costly prop campaign of all. Can you imagine for what good that money could be used for in California? And what are we fighting for? To stop a group of people in our society from being able to say they are "married." The coalition of conservative churches who have really turned this into a battle (Mormons, Evengelicals, Knights of Columbus) should be ashamed of their ads on TV about children getting hurt by Prop 8. I can only imagine how many children already hurt can be helped by the money being used to spew hate in this campaign around Prop 8. Please write to these organizations and let them know you do not appreciate their hateful agenda and to give the money to a worthy cause.

[Cole Warner]

Mahonri is a name from the Book of Mormon. This post is obviously trying mock the LDS church.

[Benny Varkel]

I have been reading several posts that argue Prop 8 is to restore the definition of marriage and protect the sanctity of marriage. I am in a so-called "traditional " marriage and do not fear gay marriage.

Stealing yard signs is wrong. Sending blackmail letters to No on Prop 8 supporters is wrong.

The crux of this issue is that Prop 8 is a civil rights issue period. In the General Election official voter information guide, page 54, the headline reads as follows:

"Proposition 8 - Eliminates the right of same-sex couples to marry."

If this is not discrimination, I do not know what is! I voted against Prop 22 in 2000 and the courts upheld my views that the majority does not have the right to eliminate the rights of minorities’.

I believe that this all stated with out of state religious interest groups wanting to rule the land. DO NOT LET THEM. VOTE NO ON 8. YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT.

For the benefit of you religious bigots, this post is written at Grade level 6.5

[Benny Varkel]

I have been reading several posts that argue Prop 8 is to restore the definition of marriage and protect the sanctity of marriage. I am in a so-called "traditional " marriage and do not fear gay marriage.

Stealing yard signs is wrong. Sending blackmail letters to No on Prop 8 supporters is wrong.

The crux of this issue is that Prop 8 is a civil rights issue period. In the General Election official voter information guide, page 54, the headline reads as follows:

"Proposition 8 - Eliminates the right of same-sex couples to marry."

If this is not discrimination, I do not know what is! I voted against Prop 22 in 2000 and the courts upheld my views that the majority does not have the right to eliminate the rights of minorities’.

I believe that this all stated with out of state religious interest groups wanting to rule the land. DO NOT LET THEM. VOTE NO ON 8. YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT.

For the benefit of you religious bigots, this post is written at Grade level 6.5

[Richard Rinehart]

I don't think that Prop 8 needs to divide liberals and conservatives or people from different religious backgrounds. I think if one reasons it out rationally, voting no on prop. 8 just makes sense from all sides.

Vote NO on Prop. 8 because:

- Prop 8 Takes Away Existing Rights. In June 2008, along with Mass. and Conn. (and much of Europe and Canada), CA Supreme court affirmed the right to marry whom one wants. Since then, thousands of gay folk have married, and guess what? Society did not crumble. Heterosexual marriage remains safe and sound. Prop 8 would take away rights from thousands and *destroy* marriages.
- Economics. CNBC stated that gay marriages bring in an additional $228 million to public funds in CA annually, and the Congressional budget office estimates that to be $1 billion nationally. At a time when CA and the US are cutting funding for schools and medicare, this new free income won't cost other taxpayers a cent and helps our bottom line.
- Civil Rights. Until 1967 blacks and whites could not marry each other in many states. In 1967 the US Supreme Court overturned those laws, affirming marriage as a civil rights issue, "Marriage is one of the "basic civil rights of man," fundamental to our very existence and survival...". Civil rights should not be granted to some segments of society and denied others.
- Religious Rights. The very first of the American Bill of Rights confirms freedom of religion. No church would ever be forced to perform a gay marriage if they didn't want to. But those that want to, can; the United Church of Christ, Presbytarian Church, Unitarian Universalist Assoc., Reform Judaism, and many Christians and others allow same-sex marriage. Allow everyone their right to choose to worship in their own way; that's American.

[Betty Johnson]

I feel that we should stick to the basic idea of marriage. It is and always was the legal union between a man and a woman. I feel that we should not change the idea of marriage, after 1000's of years. Vote yes on Proposition 8!

[Natalie]

yes on prop 8!

[O.J. Simpson]

pretty much if you vote no i'll come to your house and get you, and you don't want that.

[Jenny]

Vote yes on Prop 8:

Whether or not you support marriage between homosexuals should not be the only consideration that determines how you vote.

The activist judges in California overturned the voice of the people who already voted against same-sex marriage. If U.S. citizens vote for something, our elected officials should not be allowed to counter the voice of the people.

If proposition 8 is not passed, the rights of those who disagree with same-sex marriage will be jeopardized. Those who refuse to perform marriages for homosexuals will be subject to lawsuits. Parents of children in public schools who disagree with the teaching of same-sex marriage will not have the right to refuse this education.

Under California law, homosexuals in domestic partnerships, "shall have the same rights, protections and benefits" as married spouses.

This proposition is about protecting the religious rights of U.S. citizens, not about hate or discrimination toward homosexuals.

http://whatisprop8.com/

[Daniel]

I will be voting yes on 8 because I believe that marriage is between a man and a woman. Also because marriage, to me, is a Holy Sacrament and do not wish to have the sanctity of my marriage diminished.

That being said, if the gay community came up with a term that is acceptable to them, life partnerships, love union, garriage or whatever they deem appropriate to signify their union and allow them to have equal rights under law would be fine with me, and possibly a lot of other people who value their marriages. It might also help bridge the gap and diffuse so much of the hatred between the opposing sides.

To the gay community I say love who you wish, live how you want. Just don't call your union a marriage.

And yes I will support a ban on divorce.

[Donna S]

I'm voting no on 8

My beliefs on gays have nothing to do with it.

I wonder why so many people who claim to be religious also forgot

Thou Shalt Not Judge.

If there is judgement - that can be at judgement day... BY GOD.

Intolerange and lack of empathy for others behavior and beliefs will ALSO BE JUDGED.

[can'tbelieveit]

I can't believe how many hypocrites are on this board, saying they "love their gay friends" yet are still advocating yes on prop 8. That's qualifying your love, isn't it? You are trying to 'soften' your position by saying something nice about gay people while at the same time voting to take away their civil rights. Come clean and admit your bigotry for what it is.

NO on prop 8, separate church and state!

[Katherine]

I find the greater sum of the arguments against gay marriage to be laughable. To cite a single religious doctrine as the sole authority of marriage globally is rather like trying to press every human being into a mold of Kate Moss. The vast majority of us just won't fit into that mold.

The truth of the matter is that "marriage" and other "life union ceremonies" have been performed LONG before the Christian religion was formed. Consider the case of various oriental and middle-eastern nations where polygamy was practiced even until very recently, where it was not uncommon for nobles to have not only wives/husbands, but also concubines and slaves. Or further, look deeper into the so-called Christian kingdoms of Europe and the decadence and debauchery that took place at the expense of the commoners' taxes because the leaders were "ordained by God".

I have read the Bible. If we followed every line of the Bible to the literal translation, one would be forced to wed his brother's widow and provide her children if she had none. And you could also buy your wife or take her as the spoils of war. But we live in a so-called 'civilized' society and we can temper our beliefs with our intellect to act not just in our own best interest but the best interests of the world at large. That, I believe, is the true interpretation of the bible - to act altruistically for the benefit of mankind as a whole.

[Mike]

Yes on 8. Being "tolerant" as a Christian does not mean that I should aid what is acknowledged in the Bible as a sin.

You are who you are, and I can tolerate that.

However, I refuse to support your sin; refuse to spread it and refuse to acknowledge that it is "okay."

If you vote "No" on 8, you directly refute the Bible. Take it for what you will, but choose carefully.

Just like on Nov. 4 - do you vote your economy or your morals? Do you vote for "this world" or "the next?" I cannot condone the killing of any child (pro-life) regardless of age or fetal development. Why would you condone such behavior? Murder is against the law - why is abortion okay?

Vote as you will; we all answer for our choices in the end.

Take care.

[Matthew]

First of all, I am disappointed by the hateful comments that have been posted. Mature people can disagree without being disagreeable. I support Prop 8. I encourage others to vote YES on Prop 8. I am grateful that we live in a nation where we can vote, and the majority can decide upon an issue. Please get out and vote no matter what your opinions are. It is a blessing to live in America where we can do that.

[JesusWouldVoteNo]

Prop 8 FORCES the christian religion on everyone, actually resulting is LESS religious freedoms. This would deteriorate the fundamental core of our country’s existence- people came to America to flee religious views that were imposed on them AGAINST their will. How is it right to do the same thing today? Second, the law should treat everyone equally. Did you know that in 1967 about 70% of Californians opposed interracial marriage? The court ruled that same year it was unconstitutional to ban it. No matter how you feel about marriage, it is NOT right to treat people differently under the law. Before Brown v. Board of Education we had segregation and the truth is, most people supported it. What the “majority” of people think doesn’t necessarily mean it’s the RIGHT thing, as history has shown us. Can you imagine if today you were not able to marry the person you love because they have a different color skin than yours? Or if your child’s classroom was still divided by race? How would you feel if you couldn’t marry the person YOU love?

[Carolyne Cervantes]

I am opposed on Prop 8...nobody should restrict the lives of people or take their rights away. For those people who are talking about Religion "HOW GOD DOESNT ALLOW THIS OR THAT" well did you 4get that politics and religion does not connect?! WELL maybe you should remember that because arent we all children of GOD anyway..WHO ARE YOU to tell people how to live their life..this is the 21st century and you should all deal with the new culture that the U.S should support. And for those who think this is jeopordizing their childrens life...when they grow up eventually they are the ones to decide how to live their life to be gay or not. how does it affect the parents life? Are You going to deny you're KID if they were GAY...PROBABLY NOT cuz you would love them anyway for who they are. I OPPOSE 8 AND SO SHOULD EVERYONE ELSE !!!!!!!!!

p.s I HOPE I WAS ABLE TO INFLUENCE YOU

<3 CAROLYNE

[Please Help Us!]

I'm not kiddiing when I say the prop 8 supporters are on every street corner in south orange county. If you're against discriminiation then please vote no. I'm ao desperate that I feel like a Jew rooting against the Nazis.

[......]

I'm voting no on 8!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Matt]

Hate isn't it nice? Stop the hate vote no on 8!

[Casey Snoeberger]

If the marriage is not yours, then you really shouldnt even be able to vote on it. Straight marriage (or "Traditional Marriage" as some like to refer to it as) has historically had around a 50% divorce rate. If marriage and family is so sarcred, how is it allowable to deny faithful gays the same right? Especially with straight marriages creating so many so called "broken homes"? The ideal of family is different in each home. As a gay American, my family is full of love, respect, and tolerance. Sure, I would like to be treated with respect and equality, but regardless, my family will continue to prosper and thrive. I love my boyfriend, all the yes votes on prop 8 in all the world will not change that.

Straight couples continue to marry and procreate. There is a decent chance your children will be gay. I believe in the positive future of this great nation, if you dont want to treat us gays with respect, there is a better chance your children will be more tolerant. Vote your heart, not your fears.

One gay, hard-working, tax-paying, VOTING, American..

[david t]

While many mormons have donated a great amount of money to the campaign, the mormon church itself has not donated any.

[david t]

Is it just me, or does the “No on 8” campaign have uninformative ads? There is the one with the girl running to her wedding to meet...a man. There is the one with the parents talking about their lesbian daughter, but not marriage. There is the one that quotes various newspapers. (When did newspapers start endorsing political issues? I always thought they were supposed to be objective.) Then there is the new one from Senator Feinstein. None of these show same-sex couples. None of these even mention the phrase, "gay marriage." In fact, the new phrase for the “No” campaign is, "No matter how you feel about marriage, vote No on 8." Consider the phrases, "No matter how you feel about animals, vote no on 2," or "No matter how you feel about global warming, vote no on 7." I don’t know if the “Yes” campaign is any better, but I just wanted to point it out.

[david t]

By the way, most of the money that comes from mormons comes from California mormons.

[david t]

Ultimately, the concept of marriage will be withheld from certain types of relationships. It will discriminate. Whether you equate that relationship with an individual is the rub. I was speaking with someone yesterday who said that if a father wanted to marry his son, that they should be entitled to it. Certainly, the type of relationship between a father and a son is relevantly different from a husband and a wife. I'm not saying one relationship is better or worse than the other, just relevantly different. Yet, because of my views, I am considered closed-minded, uneducated, and a bigot. I have relatives who practice homosexuality. I don't hate them. I love them.

[david t]

The “No ” campaign should explain what marriage means to them and show how same-sex couples fit in this model. Not only is it informative, but it relieves the mind of many who are worried about the end result of this open-ended question. "Love" is hardly an objective term to qualify a marriage relationship. Furthermore, can we simply take any behavior, classify it as an "identity," put a protection clause around it and give it the title of marriage? Even the Williams Institute has not proposed a new, definitive model for marriage. (At least, I could not find it on their web-site) Please don’t misunderstand. I am not trying to offend anyone. I try to show compassion for all people.

[david t]

When it comes to bank loans, employment, and housing, to me, there is no relevant difference between a homosexual and a heterosexual. The real question is whether or not the relationship between a man and a woman is relevantly different from other types of relationships as it pertains to what one considers marriage. It seems to me that the dignity and respect associated with term "marriage" comes from centuries of child-producing and child-rearing. When it comes to what I consider marriage, there is a relevant difference. It is not bigotry, it is biology. I feel that gender is still an important part of our society. And in the end, every child deserves a father and a mother. Even if you don't believe in this ideal, I hope you can at least respect someone for holding it. However, this is no longer about tolerance for individuals, but celebration and support for behavior, even to the extent of suing individuals who do not wish to support it. (Check out NPR’s web-site on the various lawsuits) A “Yes ” vote won’t necessarily change all of that. However, a "No" vote will simply give more ammunition for lawsuits against those who believe this ideal. And they will lose under the term “discrimination.”

[david t]

Marriage is not a fundamental/civil right. Individuals can have various types of relationships. THAT is their right. Having society call it marriage is society's discretion. We take a vote. We don't let judges use a legal technicality. Can you think of a relationship that you would not want society to call marriage? If so, then you are discriminating. You can't just throw the term "civil right" around unless you really mean it. Religion is a civil right. No matter how many people vote against it, you can believe what you want. Speech is a civil right. No matter how many people vote against it, you can say what you want. That is what a civil right is. Marriage is NOT a civil right. If that were the case, then you could marry whomever you wanted. Any type of relationship could be called marriage. Don't say it unless you really mean it.

Furthermore, this is not just a religious issue. Until very recently, every society and culture, every color of people, and every nation that I have ever studied, has always considered marriage between a man and a woman. All of these scare tactics (closed-mindedness, bigotry, racism, religious fanaticism, etc.) have become tiresome. So I end with one question, "if not prop 8, what is the new marriage model?" Think about it "critically" and make sure there are no flaws in your logic, and that it fits with what you feel society should support. I've tried. So far, the best I could come up with was, "one man, one woman."

[david t]

So far, many of the premises regarding the “marriage equality” issue are largely misunderstood or false. For example, the claim that gay marriage is a gay right and that gays deserve the same rights as heterosexuals misses the point. Both straight and gay individuals can not marry someone of the same gender. No one denies someone to marry someone else based on his or her sexual orientation. A gay man is allowed to marry almost any woman he wants, assuming they are not closely related, or he is already married. A gay man is not allowed to marry another man. Hence, this whole issue is a gender issue, not a sexual orientation issue. In order to grab the “minority” and “sexual orientation” argument, they first had to have civil unions. (A word to the wise to those in other states)

[Tamarasw]

Why doesn't anyone ever discuss the rights of children? Every child wants a mother and a father; in fact, every child deserves a home with a mother AND a father, yet children don't get to vote. Voting NO on Prop 8 takes away children's rights. For the desires of homosexual couples to take precedence over what is best for children is just wrong...completely wrong! Marriage is supposed to be between a man and a woman...for good reason. It just plain makes sense! And that relationship is best for children...and society. If you think about it, there really is no other option than voting YES on Prop 8!

[david t]

Evidence that the LGBT movement does not understand the results of their ideology.

The LGBT group is made up of lesbians, gays, bisexuals, and transgender individuals. They are striving to gain “marriage equality.” Many LGBT members have insisted that allowing gay marriage will not open doors for polygamous groups. However, consider the possible motives for bisexuals in this group. If a person is bisexual and chooses to marry someone of the opposite sex, then they are agreeing, through marriage, to remain faithful to that person. Doing so would require their foregoing a bisexual lifestyle. In other words, they will have to conform to exclusive heterosexuality. Thus, they would no longer be a bisexual. The same applies if they marry someone of the same sex. Ultimately, bisexuals cannot support “marriage equality,” as being in their best interest, without also requiring some form of plural marriage legislation as well. In other words, do we have to legalize polygamy so that bisexuals also have "marriage equality?"

[david t]

Remember: When it comes to Supreme Court Rulings, the reason is just as important as the decision. Let’s take a look at the reasons Justice Ronald M. George and the majority opinion took regarding “In re Marriage Cases.”

"[B]ecause of the widespread disparagement that gay individuals historically have faced, it is all the more probable that excluding same-sex couples from the legal institution of marriage is likely to be viewed as reflecting an official view that their committed relationships are of lesser stature than the comparable relationships of opposite-sex couples. Finally, retaining the designation of marriage exclusively for opposite sex couples and providing only a separate and distinct designation for same-sex couples may well have the effect of perpetuating a more general premise — now emphatically rejected by this state — that gay individuals and same-sex couples are in some respects "second-class citizens" who may, under the law, be treated differently from, and less favorably than, heterosexual individuals or opposite-sex couples. Under these circumstances, we cannot find that retention of the traditional definition of marriage constitutes a compelling state interest. Accordingly, we conclude that to the extent the current California statutory provisions limit marriage to opposite-sex couples, these statutes are unconstitutional."

Now to those who don’t think that same-sex marriage rulings will not result in polygamous weddings, let’s change just one or two words and see if the reason does or does not fall apart.

"[B]ecause of the widespread disparagement that bisexual individuals historically have faced, it is all the more probable that excluding bisexual “couples” from the legal institution of marriage is likely to be viewed as reflecting an official view that their committed relationships are of lesser stature than the comparable relationships of opposite-sex/monogamous couples. Finally, retaining the designation of marriage exclusively for opposite sex couples and providing only a separate and distinct designation for bisexual/polygamous “couples” may well have the effect of perpetuating a more general premise — now emphatically rejected by this state — that bisexual individuals and bisexual/polygamous “couples” are in some respects "second-class citizens" who may, under the law, be treated differently from, and less favorably than, heterosexual individuals or opposite-sex couples. Under these circumstances, we cannot find that retention of the traditional definition of marriage constitutes a compelling state interest. Accordingly, we conclude that to the extent the current California statutory provisions limit marriage to opposite-sex couples, these statutes are unconstitutional."

Big difference? Clearly not. Bisexual groups, i.e. one bisexual man with a male partner and a female partner simultaneously, or some similar combination, have seen disparagement. A rejection of a legal recognition of their relationship would be considered an official view that their relationship stature is of a lesser stature. Finally, that rejection would be viewed as these groups being considered second-class citizens.

So why does Justice Ronald M. George use this type of argument. Well, to me, it is simple. Nobody wants to argue against it because nobody wants to call another person a “second-class citizen.” In fact, you could probably replace that term “gay individuals” above with nearly anything, (siblings, close cousins, etc. by the way, CA laws allow first cousins to get married. If nothing else, prop 8 will restore the dignity of marriage, at least to some degree) and the argument is still difficult to counter. Furthermore, nobody wants to say that one’s relationship is of a lesser stature than another’s.

Unfortunately, bad policies still exist.

[david t]

Same-sex individuals can have relationships as they please; however, the term "marriage" has a strong relationship of those that will procreate society. Imagine the above situation: a child growing up with no mother (depending on situation), and the government supporting it, to the extent that it mandates all agencies that receive any type of government support, to also support. Can you imagine that? This is not a situation of divorce or death. This is the government and society supporting the institution where a child does not have both a father and a mother! It is not just having two parents. Two is not a magic number. It is about a child learning how to recognize and relate to gender. And if you don't think gender is relevant in society, just remember...if it weren't for gender, you wouldn't be here.

[david t]

Why is CA giving out marriage licenses to people who do not live here, and have no intentions on moving here?

[david t]

I think it is silly that Mayor Villagosa even gets involved. He cheated on his wife hundreds of times. What does he know about marriage? The same could be said for Mayor Newson and almost all of Hollywood. Sure, they are great actors, but are these the role models that society looks to when it comes to married life?
And these are the heros of the gay community. How sad.

[Danny]

Mahonri

I wish your extremist comments would be more widely published by the Yes on 8 campaign, because it is exactly what this proposition is about:

It is not about activitist judges
It is not about school curriculae
It is that certain groups believe the gay lifestyles disqualifies them from fully participating in society.

(by the way, the answer to the hypothetical question is that if the Yes on 8 folks said what they believed, they would lose an overwhelming portion of their support)

[Hindu group urges voters to reject Proposition 8]

Navya Shastra Urges California Voters to Reject Proposition 8

Troy, Michigan—October 31, 2008—Navya Shastra, the international Hindu reform organization, urges California voters to reject Proposition 8, which would eliminate the right of same-sex couples to marry under state law.

The organization notes that Hinduism has never classified homosexuality as a sin against God. While some ancient law codes have spoken out against homosexual acts, the tradition has never called for the persecution of homosexuals. In fact, there is ample evidence that alternative lifestyles have been accepted throughout Hindu history. Several modern Hindu leaders have also spoken positively of gay rights, though disappointingly, a significant percentage of American Hindus remain uncomfortable with homosexuality. “According to the Hindu contemplative tradition, we are all manifestations of the one universal spirit, straight or gay, and worthy of the same respect and rights” said Jaishree Gopal, Navya Shastra Chairman, “we urge American Hindus in California to remember this central insight of their faith when they vote on November 4,” she added.

[Adrian]

The Prop 8 commercials are stating that gay marriage will be taught in schools across California. From a high-school student, I can tell you right now that we aren't even being taught about what they call, "traditional" marriage. We have the Gay-Straight alliance at our school which teaches students to accept and be tolerant of the way people live. I think that this is a great contribution to my generation and future generations because we are being taught to live with open minds and are being taught that accepting the way people live is the mature, normal way to go about these things. Prop 8 is eliminating the right for someone to marry the person they love. I am a straight 15 year old and would definitely not like that to happen to me. Same-sex couples have been fighting for their rights for some time now and they definitely deserve to marry the person they want to spend their life with.

[Robert C]

Prop 8 has nothing to do with saving traditional marriage. It is simply about codifying discrimination into our State constitution. If the goal is to save traditional marriage, why hasn't someone written a proposition that bans divorce? If it is solely a convenant with God, why can Atheist be married? If it is about procreation, then why can post-menopausal women get married? Prop 8 is solely legalized discrimination on a select group- Gay and Lesbians- of hard-working, tax-paying California citizens. Why must our State continue to promote the divisiveness of the Christian right have created over the past 8 years?

[Ana]

Whether homosexual couples are married or not, they will still be homosexual. Therefore, even if Prop 8 passes, Christians aren't ending the "sin of homosexuality." The Bible never prioritizes sin. I know Christians who lie, gossip and judge on a daily basis. I also know Christians who have committed adultery and/or divorced. Despite what they may think, they are no more righteous than homosexuals. Jesus loved and continued to associate with people who were considered unacceptable in society... if Christians want to live in Jesus' image they need to stop accusing homosexuals of corrupting marriage and being incapable of raising children. That is not love and acceptance. That is judgement. Let God do the judging.

[Carlos V]

Yes on Prop 8!

[Me]

JUST DO YOURSELF AND THE WORLD A WHOLLEEE LOTTT OF GOOD.
AND VOTE YESSSSSSSS ON PROP 8!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
THANKS I LOVE YOU ALL.

[Richard]

Homosexual individuals will still have all the same rights that they have always had. Prop 8 simply protects the sacred institution of marriage.

http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/commentary/the-divine-institution-of-marriage

Please protect this sacred union and VOTE YES ON PROP 8!!!

[Storm]

Vote yes on eight! Love ya

[renata]

DUDE!!
this is about rights!!
who cares about all this religious crap and the Whole "marriage is sacred"
READ THE FRIGGiN CONSTITUTION!
the point is that gay people have the right to marry
RIGHTS!
STOP BEING SELFISH AND THINK ABOUT HOW U WOULD FEEL IF SOMEONE TRIED TO STRIP U Of YOUR RIGHTS...
OK?!!!!

NO ON PROP. 8!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[renata]

RIGHT PEOPLE RIGHTS!!!
WHO CARES ABOUT THIS RELIGIOUS AND "MARRIAGE IS SACRED" OR "FOR THE CHILDREN" CRAP!
B.S. OK.
READ THE FRIGGIN CONSTITUTION

NO ON PROP 8!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[None of your business]

if no on eight passes they will teach kids in public school that it is ok to marry the same sex. in states were it is legal to marry same sex, kids in second grade read
stories like - " King and king", and mommy and mommy's wedding". It's just wrong! god designed us to be man and wife. not wife and wife!
Vote yes on eight.
YES ON EIGHT!!!!!!!!

[Cory Savage]

AS A CHRISTIAN I PRAY THAT ALL OF YOU TEACHING HATRED AND SAYING IT IS IN GODS NAME THAT YOU GET MERCY IN HEAVEN. WE ARE QUICK TO QUOTE SCRIPTURE THAT MAKES US FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE ABOUT OUR OPINIONS. PLEASE DO NOT FORGET THE MOST IMPORTANT SCRIPTURE IN THE BIBLE.

"AND NOW ABIDE FAITH,HOPE, LOVE, THESE THREE: BUT THE GREATEST OF THESE IS LOVE"
1 CORINTHIANS 13:13

"Judge not, and ye shall not be judged." Luke 6:37 -

[Philip]

If, as homosexuals state, they are discriminated against in tax breaks, insurance or other types of preferential treatment, then so are all single people. Single individuals do not receive certain institutionalized benefits. These benefits are provided by governments and societies for children; to facilitate and assist a married couple in what is a societal and government imperative—bearing and effectively rearing the next generation.

Homosexuals do enjoy full rights within civil unions (AB 205), except for Federal Tax benefits (obviously, b/c same-sex marriage is so far a states' issue). Claims by homosexuals that their rights are not protected and their needs are not being met are simply not true. Marriage is not necessary for homosexuals to provide for any of life’s eventualities - - simple, inexpensive legal documents used routinely by single individuals offer all necessary protections. The crucial role of child bearing within marriage should not be diminished and diluted simply because homosexuals believe they are entitled to benefits that were put in place expressly for children and their heterosexual parents.

[Philip]

"If two people love each other, they should be allowed to marry."--Not valid. "We love many people that we don’t marry. If feelings of love or affection were all that mattered, fathers should be able to marry their own daughters, brothers could marry sisters, etc. Were there no restrictions on marriage, the possible arrangements would be endless. If marriage is based solely on one’s affections, the need for companionship, the desire for sexual stimulation, or wanting increased benefits, then there is no logical reason for not legalizing polygamous, incestuous or pedophilic marriages." (Family Issues Guide)

[Philip]

"If two people love each other, they should be allowed to marry."--Not valid. "We love many people that we don’t marry. If feelings of love or affection were all that mattered, fathers should be able to marry their own daughters, brothers could marry sisters, etc. Were there no restrictions on marriage, the possible arrangements would be endless. If marriage is based solely on one’s affections, the need for companionship, the desire for sexual stimulation, or wanting increased benefits, then there is no logical reason for not legalizing polygamous, incestuous or pedophilic marriages." (Family Issues Guide)

[Linsday]

To Philip:

You are ridiculous and that little statement by "family issues guide" is ridiculous. That is truly a sorry attempt to justify why same-sex marriage should be banned. Tell me, for what reasons did you get married (assuming that you are married)? How do you define your own marriage if not out of feelings of love and affection? This simply shows your desperation and ignorance. Seriously, if you believe that verbal diarrhea, I feel sorry for you. Have you never felt true, romantic love? Because you don't seem to be able to distinguish the difference between romantic love and platonic love.

[Melanie]

I f you beleive the lie that it is NOT about School children look up Harvey Milk Day.
AB 2567 | Harvey Milk Day
This bill would require the governor proclaim May 22 each year as Harvey Milk Day. It would encourage public schools and educational institutions to conduct suitable commemorative exercises on that date.

So who was Harvey Milk? By passing this bill, the Senate Education Committee acknowledges the unprecedented legacy of Harvey Milk and the importance of teaching our future generations the important role he played in history,” said EQCA Executive Director Geoff Kors. “Through his staunch commitment to human rights, Milk, one of the nation’s first openly gay leaders, inspired a community to stand strong in the face of aversion. Perhaps more than any other figure, Harvey Milk’s life and political career embody the rise of the LGBT civil rights movement.” and what is LGBT. Look it up on Wikipedia. I do not want school age children to learn about lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender/transsexual lifestyles. I voted "Yes" to stop bill's like this and protect our children. I am thankful that Arnold Schwarzenegger vetoed the bill.
They do want their view taught in school beginning at the youngest ages, we have to stand strong and say no.

[Jenny Herrera]

I recieved a message from a friend trying to convince me of agreeing the acceptance of gay & lesbian marriage.before the election happened.
I'm a mother & of course I'm a Latina..
but in my family growing up that type of preference was not holy by god.

The saying of "Be who you are" I understand, but im worried that if every one were to agree what type of choices will my daughter be faced for example: that she can marry a women ? I want to be able to see my grand children one day. I dont believe its logical.. for the world to accept gay & lesbian marriage. the creation of life will stop, meaning less babies born or even more diseases from same sex intercourse. plain & simple.. children dont need to see same sex couples kissing on the streets, as a parent .. I dont aprrove of it. I dont have anything against gays or lesbians.. I even have friends.. who choose to be gay or lesbian .. but concerning marriage, its only between a man & a women. Women have the ability to give life with of course the help of a man . with out a man & women together what will become of this???? so far if you happen to be gay or a lesbian you could love who ever you choose. Live & Die with that person you dont nessesary have to marry that person to show your love to the world or them .. knowing you love that person is enough I think so ... . like someone said god has spoken .. ONE LOVE PEACE IN OUR HEARTS & im out .. .

[Sue from Minnesota]

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=17878
check this out! church loses tax exempt status for partisan activities. These right winged kool aid drinkers need to be stopped! Who are they to decide how others live, let them live their freakish ways and leave others alone. they are going too far and what will be next? We may all burn in hell (according to them) so be it. Im waiting for the apocalypse to happen as stated if we elected Obama. They are right winged nuts and so are their followers!! Call it morman, babtist, evangelica, they are all right winged nuts and need to be stopped from imposing their beliefs on others. whats next? overturn Roe vs. Wade? ya they will if allowed. Civil unions need to be expanded legally to include all rights of the matrimony, We need a revolution to stop these nuts from gaining anymore strength. Prop 8 may not concern you as it doesnt me but the idea of how far these nuts will go concerns me. We need to stop them before they have us all bible toten. a straight from Minnesota.

[Sad for You]

Jenny Herrera, if your daughter is going to turn out to be a lesbian, then she will. All the bible beating in the world isn't going to change that. Of course, you can try to make her so afraid of her own sexuality and fear homosexuality. Then she might end up living her life in the closet, marry an man she hates every time he touches her. Basically destroy her life and the man she marrys. That's what my parents tried to do to me. Half my life was wrecked. I hope if a young girl finds out that is her sexual orientation, then she should have the freedom to marry who she chooses and be happy. That's what I hope for our future children. A much healthier way to live in this world.

[leatriz larson]

We are not asking to get married in your church but in OUR state. NO on 8!!!!!!!!!!

[Sui Generis]

LOVE, COMPASSION, ACCEPTANCE & PEACE is what I believe my GOD is about. I don't have to rely on any mortal being that claims he has a direct communion with God to tell me what His word is for I believe we are all created equal, my blood runs red just like anyone else. I experience love, happiness, pain, sadness, hope, despair and every other human emotions just like anyone else. When my long term partner of 10 years was in an accident that took his life, I couldn't get any information from the police, even the coroners office wouldn't grant me access to him for only family members or a spouse can have such access. I was deprived of every benefit that otherwise would have been bestowed upon any married heterosexual couple. So, until there exist a form of legal union (which doesn't have to be called Marriage) that grants same sex couples all the privileges of that of a married heterosexual couple, I will continue my endeavour to support the cause of towards equality.

[Megan]

Honestly, why does anyone care who gets married. "God" and the "bible" are not real. get that through your thick and closed minded heads. if a man and a man or a woman and a woman want to marry THEY WILL. It is not up to anyone who is not in the relationship. If your "religion" makes you believe it is wrong, cool. i believe in flying pigs for goodness sakes. But just because you believe in something doesn't mean anyone else has to. By legalizing gay marriage no one is giving anything up, no one is being hurt, and no one is going to die. This shouldn't even be an issue in the first place. WE LIVE IN AMERICA, LAND OF THE FREE. Does anyone know what that means??? I am not gay, but i support LOVE. So all you religious fanatics, keep your idiotic ideals to yourself. :] thanks.

[Samantha]

Hi, I have a comment. First and for most i am a Christian.. but guess what.. I BELIEVE GAYS SHOULD HAVE THEIR RIGHTS. In the Bible God talks about love... so why should there be a limit... maybe on certain things like inbreeding YES but gay marriage... come on.. how will it even effect you. Will it really be that painful to see people happy and loving eachother of the opposite sex? Will it really be that painfull to realize that our country is putting its discrimination behind? Because gay marriage means that we would finally be uniting as one nation, that we will finally be excepting people for who they are. What right do we have to ignor the Bill of Rights. Why did we go threw things like the Civil Rights act if we were just going to end up back here on this time it's not color is sexual preference. Think about that. Give them their rights, the rights that many people in this country DIED for, why deny someone love just because you don't approve of it, that's the most unfair judgemental immature thing I have ever heard. It amazes me that I'm 17 years old and more mature then half you people. I was raised that marriage is between man and woman, but the times have changed. Gay people dont hide because they're ashamed they hide because YOU wont except them.. it has nothing to do with them being "wrong" it has to do with them being afriad to get beat up murdered, descriminated against. Everyone is entitled to there opinion, dont hassel me for mine, yours to is respected within me. I just can't see our Nation progressing or getting better if we cant even give people a harmless right.

Love has not limits, Gay Striaght, it doesn't matter, love is within you, it's the only spirit that keeps us going when times are hard, it's the closest thing we have to magic. Love is within Gay people to.. let them experience the magic... let them be able to marry... let them be able to say i do

I appologize for my ill grammar and bad spelling, I was rushing.

Thank you,
Ohio, 17, sam

[Samantha]

Ok. Since Prop 8 was already voted on i can't tell you to vote no, but i can tell u to be open minded, and i can tell all the gay people out there to stand up for there rights, it doesnt matter that people are against you, what matters is that you get what you're deserving of, and that is indeed your rights.

Im a Christian, I have my own beliefs, and i dont believe you go to hell for being gay, and i dont believe God will disown you for being gay. I think that God is in the heavens looking down on all the gay people with acceptance and love. There is only one life to live and the other is far away from now for some of us. If you dont believe thatas fine, and i hate how people of my religion come on here and preasure people into believing that's not fair at all. I have my opinion and please don't reply with ignorant actions to my comment but, gay's deserve the right to marry, civil union whatever!

Im doing a report on Gay rights for my senior report, and I am studying it right now which is the reason i am on this site and i am irritated to see people so immature, judgemental, and heartless. If you don't agree that is your opinion, but being rude is another thing. I believe that us as straight people HAVE NO RIGHT to vote on something that will not effect us that will only effect the people of subject. What right to we have to take away someones rights.

Bill of Rights:
Amendment 1
"...Freedom for people to peacably assemble"

Let them be what they want do what they want and LOVE how they want. It doesnt effect us? It wont wrip the eyes out of a young child. Doing this would be our first step to being one nation "UNITED" truth be told, we haven't been united since the days of Martin Luther king. Its pathedic to know the things we have gone threw as a country meant nothing to certain people. The Civil Rights Movement, Slavery... ALL THE HATRED CAUSE PAINA NS SUFFERING. but throughout all the pain and suffering the people that were fighting for their rights WON... so i have news for america, for califorinia, and everyone who voted YES. It isnt over, people will fight for there rights, and i believe AS A CHRISTIAN (for those who said god is against them as if!) that GAY isnt wrong, Gays deserve there rights.

thanks

17samOH

[Marlyna]

It seems that a lot of the fear of us, meaning Gays and Lesbians, getting married stems from the fact that people of the church believe we want to take over their religions and force ourselves upon them. The funny thing is, I have yet to hear ONE homosexual say they want to get married in a church just because the church doesn't like it. Everyone gets discriminated against, every day. I've watched family and friends get torn apart because they don't feel it's safe anymore for them to be who they want to be, who they feel they are. What right is it of anyone else to say what and who we are?

Let me just say something to those trying to choose for us. No matter what, we will always feel what we feel and be who we have to be to feel comfortable in our own skin. You and anyone else that tries to get in the way of that enlightenment, will not succeed. We don't need YOUR okay to be who we are.

And to touch upon the subjects that Jenny Herrera stated in her comment. I completely agree with you that it's not okay for a homosexual couple to display any type of physical affection beyond a peck on the lips, hand holding, or hugging in public areas... But my belief goes far beyond that and touches upon the heterosexual population as well. Neither side of the fence should be displaying their affection in manners that are anything but platonic out in the open. No one wants to see that, period, no matter who you are. The matter of making babies? You evidently haven't heard that babies are being made out of the sanctity of your marriages every day. Making a child has nothing to do with marriage. It has to do with sex.

Furthermore, if your daughter wants to marry a woman, it's not going to be because she's allowed to. It's going to be because she wants to. Just like if a woman wants to marry a man, she's not going to do it just because she can. There may be many reasons for it, but I'm sure it's not that one. Lol.
I'm glad you mentioned sexual diseases in same sex couples, because guess what? Straight couples have them as well. There is no guarantee that because you are gay you are GOING to get an STD. Unprotected sex is all that warrants that type of conclusion, not being gay.

But THANK YOU, truly, for giving us your blessing on loving who we want to, no matter the sex or race of that person. But I have yet to see God speak on the matter. All I've ever seen is man speak on the matter. You show me God's words, not written in a man's hand, and I will retract every single statement I've made today. Until then, you have no real leg to stand on except your disgust at people you don't even know.

As of right now, I am ashamed to call myself a Californian... Hell, even an American. What happened to the freedom everyone preached about? What happened to our government PROTECTING the minority? What happened to the separation of church and state? Can you honestly tell me that in the face of something YOU consider a problematic society this country is going to go back on everything it's ever stood for? If so, we're no better than the discriminatory third world countries we're fighting to liberate. I'm truly disappointed...