Analyst sees 'ghost town' in Inland Empire

A financial analyst fresh from a tour of construction sites in the Inland Empire is warning Wall Street of a "ghost town" where finished homes sit vacant and additional homes are still under construction. 

"At several properties, there were a significant number of fully built homes sitting vacant along with a large number of additional homes still under construction," Sandler O'Neill & Partners analyst Aaron Deer wrote today after touring developments in Corona and Ontario. "At one master plan community, the entire development appeared to be vacant -- with the exception of crews working on new construction, it was a ghost town."

Median home prices in both communities have dropped sharply over the last year, declining 33.6% in Corona and 30.3% in Ontario, according to DataQuick Information Systems. In Corona, the median sales price fell nearly $200,000 from May 2007 to May 2008, dropping from $565,000 to $375,000.

More from Deer's note: "The homes all appeared to be empty, and there were no prospective buyers anywhere to be found. Surprisingly, the sales office was open ... but the woman working there had questionable English fluency. When asked how many homes had been sold in the past month she simply responded, 'Uh huh. Thank you. Yes!' and handed us some additional literature on the property."

More: "Perhaps the most interesting aspect to the development was what it revealed about the nature of the housing boom: that at the peak even the most undesirable and remote locations were worthy of expensive, high-end homes."

Overall, Deer's note on the California economy -- and the relative health of California-based banks and thrifts -- strikes a balanced chord, reporting that, while the "outlook remains gloomy," "the pace of new problems has slowed somewhat."

Other highlights:

• "Not surprisingly, the banks said they are seeing continued deterioration in their single-family residential construction portfolios."
• "In areas where developable land is scarce, namely San Francisco and west Los Angeles, markets are still holding up. Several banks noted very little, if any, deterioration in credit quality in these markets. Specifically, residential construction projects in San Francisco ... and western Los Angeles (mostly teardown/rebuild projects) are seeing stable prices despite slower activity."

Your thoughts? Comments? E-mail story tips to peter.viles@latimes.com
Photo credit: Sandler O'Neill & Partners

Comments

[tealeaf]

I would be extremely interested to know the following:

1) How much of the activity that drove IE was speculative? The accepted national average at peak was 25%. I'd bet it was over 40% in the IE.

2) Somewhat to SFVRE's point on housing costs, what is the mix of where these folks going? Mom & Dad's? Mexico? Kansas? OC/LA? Tent city?

I wonder if John Husing is tracking this stuff and is changing his tune. Perhaps Uncle Billy can leverage a new alias.

[yours truly, Johnny Dollar]

This isn't newsworthy.
There are ghost towns all over the California Gold country
(apologies to Huell Howser); the '49ers have long gone.
And now that the get rich quick crowd have come
(and gone) from the "Inland Empire" (what "empire?")
It's a game of musical chairs.
Are you the last man "standing?"

[Lars]

High prices bring low sales, especially now. California has been the highest priced place to live for more then 20 years, yet you people act like you cannot get a grip on why the homes are vacant. No sweat, why don't you get all those Liberal cry babies together and buy the houses for Illegal Aliens, then you can feel as if you have done something. Gosh I feel sorry for you poor folks.

[Janice Gammill]

This sentence said it all....the office worker who was NOT ENGLISH FLUENT. Last citizen out of California, shut the lights.

[pugtv]

ShockG,

Instead of making bitter comments about Laker, you can better promote your agenda by buying up one of these places at a high price.

Think about it, you reduce inventory and improve median / average price. =)

[RJP3]

As someone who grew up in California in the 1970's and lived there in the 1990's - the Inland "Empire" I laughed my butt off at the obviously desperate "wanna-be" middle class people buying homes out in the middle of no-where - with insane commutes.

Now with gas going up to $6 a gallon by the end of the year - those discount "suburban" homes will be worth their actual value considering where they are. Very little.

You do not build home that far away from jobs. Pure madness. Now everyone has to deal with reality.

[Dave Martin]

Wow, now there's a story that needs reporting...

The LA TImes headline on April 10, 2008 says, "Inland Empire's Growth to Continue."

So I guess that in 3 months the area that would rank 32nd largest in total U.S. income has just vanished.

This is not news. Is it any wonder why circulation continues to decrease at the LA Times.

Sheesh.

[Hi]

Uh-huh, thank-you, YES!

[Bob Smythe]

Image, not just crack houses but crack suburbs. Whole tracks of houses where gangs and crime can thrive. Even worse, imagine terror cells taking over whole housing tracks. Scary.

[Marc S.]

These vacant homes will turn into once-in-a-lifetime buys for middle income families . You can't point to a single place in the U.S. where vacant new homes in the midst of a financial crisis did not eventually get sold to very grateful buyers or investors who appreciated the opportunity to buy distressed properties. Five years from now the buyers who sat on the sidelines are going to want to kick themselves for not jumping at the opportunity to buy NEW homes at below replacement cost.

[Ignatz Horowitz]

Oh, well...ghost towns never hurt anyone.

[JPG]

This listing from ZIP:

"12208 BRADDOCK DRIVE, Culver City, CA 90230

4/2 2,265 sq. ft, 4,880 Sq. Ft. lot
List Date: 08/14/07 On Market: 323 days

Reduced !!! Appraised at 1,120,000... Spectacular new construction in mar vista... Craftsman inspired home with all the modern conveniences. Chef's kitchen boasts granite counters, extra deep sink,walk in pantry, and high end stainless steel appliances, including ice maker, and separate full width refrigerator and freezer. Throughout the downstairs, you will enjoy the classic appeal of oak hardwood flooring, cherry cabinets and entertainment center 10 foot ceilings and crown molding. Full pane glass doors lead to a spacious back porch, inviting guests to linger.Master suite upstairs with balcony and jaccuzzi, and bedrooms with jack&jill bath are perfect for a family with office/guest room and 3/4 bath downstairs. Laundry area is conveniently upstairs with front loading machines. Cable/network pre-wired. Two car detached garage with bonus shop area."

Price Reduced: 11/09/07 -- $1,299,000 to $1,235,000
Price Reduced: 12/05/07 -- $1,235,000 to $1,150,000
Price Reduced: 01/22/08 -- $1,150,000 to $1,120,000
Price Reduced: 03/17/08 -- $1,120,000 to $1,050,000
Price Reduced: 04/17/08 -- $1,050,000 to $984,900
Price Reduced: 06/05/08 -- $984,900 to $960,000
Price Reduced: 06/30/08 -- $960,000 to $889,000

Yes, I see, prices for new construction in West Los Angeles are holding up quite well... Perhaps this is the Compton-adjacent section of Mar Vista?

[MarkW]

This is the housing equivalent of Detroit cranking out huge SUV's that people no longer want.

Maybe the developers are legally bound to finish these developments by their respective cities. Otherwise, why are they still building?

[Lance Manco]

The place was the armpit of California 20 years ago when I left. The crime and the airpolution was unbearable. Where else could a law abiding citizen get shot at three times and have a gun pulled on them twice? I remember a few times times that a helicopter flew over with a loud speaker telling people to stay inside because the air was so bad.

[CD]

Deer's notes on California economy are complete BS. Did you see the stock market, did you see Paulson today?
Do we live on another planet in California, or do we share the same government and global economy. Deer means everything will be OK on the west side forever and ever....???Well as long as the West side is holding up, America is saved !!!! Where does he get his infos??? Who is he kidding? Are they High on something ?
Realtard mentality as usual.....

[Darrell]

I bet if I called my good buddy Chris Dodd (D) Connecticut, I could get a sweetheart deal from Countrywide Mortgage!!!

[Edditor]

Does this mean there will be enough water to go around now? The Inland developers violated almost every pact and the cities let them................we would have all eventually died of thirst. Zero lot lines. 5 bedrooms in 2000 sq ft homes...it was a disaster from the very, very beginning. All we have are the slums of the future in the Inland "Empire".

[AnEconomist]

Just wait till the water dries up....lol

[Ric]

Wow! Analysts and Speculators! Don't you just love 'em!!?? Either or these is what you become when you can't get a REAL job!!!

[Tim]

Greedy developers and quick-profit mortgage companies spent the last decade selling homes to those who had no business buying them. Now the economy is correcting itself and those who just had to build all those homes are seeing the results of this natural correction. This is no "housing crisis" like the media and Real Estate professions would like us to believe. This is simply a natural correction resulting when people who can't afford houses in the first place can no longer buy them, and the rest of us realizing that 2-hour commutes are insane.

Short term profits aren't everything. Foregoing short-term profits for long-term stability could have prevented all of this.

Tim

[Mael]

I don't know why people are amazed that housing prices fluctuate. When the real value of houses are so inflated that people end up purchasing what is essentially a crap house for outrageous prices then it is clear that something is wrong especially in California. People who value their income and personal sovereignty are leaving and rightly so. I'd love to live in Southern California but 100-150k in CA doesn't go as far as it does in the South. I hope that Californians get the message and clean house in Sacramento where the politicians seem to care more about the well being of self professed proud freaks than they do common men and women who just want to live unmolested by their government. Leave it to government to screw up paradise.

[Uncle Billy Lacks References]

Who are these people? What note are you referring to?

Here's a little humor for the day: Laura Richardson was chair of the budget committee on the Long Beach city council. Check out the photo from 2006 where she and pals are shredding an old bloated budget.

...and then read on... about how all sorts of contracts were approved with labor unions (her power base) despite not having the money for them. It will be interesting to follow this story to see if she was really a hero of the LB budget, or if she helped send them into b/k.

[mike]

What is an Inland Empire?

[clemycali]

Nothing new. The same kind of ghost towns are all over Central Valley too.

[Grant]

The fact that the photographer couldn't be bothered to roll his window down as he passed through kind of goes with the whole tone of the piece, doesn't it?

[lucky]

California, land of fruits and nuts, LA LA Land. So the mid America, and conservative states with steady real estate values were the dumb ones?

[Cale Yarborough]

Marc S-

Believe me, I'm waiting for a once-in-a-lifetime buy. But gas is going over $5 gallon. Why would I want to drive all the way home to the Land of Dirt & Meth?

[Drew]

these assets will ultimately be foreclosed, and will then be re-sold to new residents at lower and more affordable prices. population projections have California headed for 40 million+ in the next several years; it's not as though there is no demand for housing, it just has to meet the 'market clearing' price. all markets correct, including this one. i know projects that are selling well in the Inland Empire and - no surprise - they are relatively affordable to their competition. year over year sales figures are up due to the lower prices. it's fundamental economics. supply will meet demand at price. period.

[General Jack D. Ripper, USAF]

40% of California's K-12 students can't even speak English. Over half the students are now Mexicans and over half of them drop-out. There's your future tax base and solid leftist-socialist voting block that will bleed California dry. Anyone with half a brain and any significant assets that they want to hold onto has either already left California or has a "bug-out" plan in place to do so.

[yours truly, Johnny Dollar]

Alert: After the next earthquake, everything east of the
San Andreas Fault will fall into the Atlantic.
(translation: Monday I paid $4.57 point 9 for ARCO gas at
Motor and Palms; Tuesday I paid $4.37 point 9 for ARCO
gas at I-10 and Date Palm/Vista Chino..go east young man.)
The Inland Empire Strikes Out.

[Syscom3]

As people move back into the cities where the jobs are, the displaced black and latino's will move here.

[Drew]

actually, the fact is that the new home standing inventory has been dramatically reduced over the past 12 months, as the markets work back toward equilibrium. there are many examples of new-home projects selling really well in the Inland Empire, but only when their developers have met the 'market clearing' price for their homes. many banks still 'don't get it' and are unwilling to allow their inventory to be sold at the market-clearing price. time will solve that problem, and there will be owners in each of those unsold homes over the near term. the laws of supply and demand require it. it is taking time with some lenders and builders to work out specific arrangements on some of these assets. and some markets are far worse than others, the article isn't specific enough and shouldn't be used to project over the entire market.

[Cecile Warbug]

I used to live in CORONA, CA. It's actually not that far to Fullerton, Brea, etc. There are plenty of jobs near Corona. And in the other direction, you have lots of jobs in Riverside. Corona is not the middle of nowhere, nor is it that bad of a place to live. It's nothing like Riverside or Los Angeles, which are really horrible from a crime perspective.

My understanding of things is that all of Southern California is screwed, as far as housing prices and lost equity. This is not just a Corona problem. People don't care about ghost towns. They care whether or not they will have home equity that will help them retire the way they want to.

And with central banker-controlled newspapers like the LA Times, you can bet you won't read anything about how the central bankers are destroying the standard of living intentionally, to properly prepare the masses for the coming North American Union -- just like they are doing in the EU, the African Union, the Asian Union, etc.

[nimhrat]

Regarding 12208 BRADDOCK DRIVE, that's like a block from some housing projects. I used to rent right near there, and although it's not the worst place I've ever lived, I certainly wouldn't consider it to be a "nice" area. There's no way I'd spend 900k to live there. I have since moved into a "luxury" apartment about a mile or two south-west, closer to Marina Del Rey and Playa Vista, and the area is much, much nicer. It never ceases to amaze me how much difference there is within such short distances in this town.

[slim pickman]

Ha!
They didn't roll down the window because of the smell (if this was anywhere near cow pasture Ontario...!

As to Temecula area. It may be a buy, since 'there is a (bit of a) there there". And with gas prices high, the traffic isn't as bad as it was. The drive towards S.Diego is actually a pleasant one, unlike north 15, where you have hold your nose through much of it.
So, the value proposition for the "wannabe middle-class" buyers is now: Pay a little more for gas and commute time, but get a huge, new McMansion house for much less than replacement cost.
Of course, the schools and other public facilities may be a little dicey for a long while.

[Tent]

They're living in tent cities in Ontario:

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-tents
18mar18,1,5139391.story

[yours truly, Johnny Dollar]

I am now getting unsolicited telemarketing phone calls...
in Spanish. Please I don't, nor have I ever, had a 909
area code; I don't speak Spanish, nor do I buy stuff from
people who do. And, I don't listen to KGGI 99.1.

[yours truly, Johnny Dollar]

"Anal-yst see ghost town......"
How about "ghost state?"

[christine fredrickson]

I went to high school in Corona and lived there from 87-90. It was a hole then and is so much worse now it is unrecognizeable to me. At least then, the development was just really on the start and we had those lovely orange blossoms perfuming the breeze in the evening. The only thing salvagable about Corona is Miguels. Wish they had them in the midwest, where I moved, so I could afford a house and achieve some quality of life. But keep in mind it is the outrageous home prices in OC and LA that created the "Inland Empire". At that time, it was the only affordable play to buy despite the gruelling commute folks had to endure (tho gas was just $.99 a gallon at the Thrifty gas station on the corner of Lincoln). I can't beleive how the house prices in the IE climbed, considering it is still a pit but even worse now. And the air quality is horrific, chokes you with the pollution and desert heat and dust. I'm just happy to be enjoying my rainstorm and summer evening peppered with fireflies. Do miss Miguels wet burrittos though.

[David]

Wait just a minute!!!! Don't you all know they are not building anymore land.

here is another gem, buy now or you could get priced out of the market!!!!!!

[Wade Collins]

I'm constantly amused by the mentally challenged who fancy themselves as foi editors or newspaper consultants. The constant questioning why the article was written, leds me to believe thou complain too much. Perhaps some of you are the unlucky owners of these homes. Dave Martin: attacking the messenger does eactly what? Makes you feel better?

[Gardner]

The impending Inland Empire Ghetto along with skyrocketing oil prices will actually slow down the price drops in the city of LA as more and more people begin to migrate closer to their jobs. I bet you anything that house prices will bottom out and begin to rise by Fall of 2009.

[Alan Rodgers]

12208 BRADDOCK DRIVE, Culver City, CA 90230 is a little southeast of Culver and Centinella. Aren't there projects on Centinella near the highway? No, I think they're on Inglewood. Regardless, they aren't far away, and they turn what'd otherwise be a fine neighborhood (the climate in this area is amazingly better than the rest of LA -- cool and pleasant where most of the city is a hotbox) into a sort of nasty place. (Try shopping at the grocery down the street from the projects. Ick.)

[Brian]

Those homes will be filled with Illigal Alien squatters soon, don't worry. Then they'll do what they do; breed, deal drugs, and steal. All the while, they'll thrive off gov. assistance, under the table wages, and free housing cause no one will have the balls to come in and kick them out.

LA needs to be burnt to the ground. Start from scratch.

[E]

What will the call all the empty condos?

Ghost Towers?

[Clown Willie]

Stop speculators. They were a big problem, buying up
several houses for resale at inflated prices. If you buy
a house, you should be required to live in it for at least
a year, not buy up whole sections of tracts by investment
companies to then immediately relist at inflated prices.
After that happened in the 70's in Orange County, they
enacted rules against speculators. Don't they have that
in the I.E.?

[Clown Willie]

Stop speculators. They were a big problem, buying up
several houses for resale at inflated prices. If you buy
a house, you should be required to live in it for at least
a year, not buy up whole sections of tracts by investment
companies to then immediately relist at inflated prices.
After that happened in the 70's in Orange County, they
enacted rules against speculators. Don't they have that
in the I.E.?

[Mike]

Lets knock down all these godforsaken homes and lets put in some agriculture. I hate when the cities and developers all say that we need to continue building for the future population growth. This is all Malarky and is based on false data. It was all greed and now we are paying the piper.

[F. Zappa]

'Uh huh. Thank you. Yes!' She was just showing her Inland Empire "can do" spirit. In truth, this area has seen bad times before, as when General Dynamics was chased from California. It will bounce back.

The Metrolink provides reliable access to Los Angeles, Gold Line will eventually expand to Ontario Airport. If you need an affordable warehouse to service Southern California, (or an affordable house, for that matter) I.E. is still your best choice.

[ASterling]

As a fifth generation Southern California native, currently working in downtown Los Angeles, and having grown up in both Hollywood and Redlands - the article is right about the huge tract developments that were stuck in the middle of the collapse. Many of these areas were insanely overbuilt, and speculatively so, just as the first commenter suggests.

People are very ignorant about the area in general, do not know the communities, and make offensive statements because they probably think it makes them sound "smart." There is no higher quality of life in many areas of the LA Basin; in fact - quite the opposite. Weirdly, there's no reason for houses in Panorama City or Sylmar to be supposedly "worth more" - yeah, like the air quality is better there! I think not (and there are more than enough studies to back it up). The air quality in general all over the southland is SO much better. What a bunch of bozos. It's really "funny" isn't - people's livelihoods and communities destroyed by greedy, speculative developers.

I think houses are going to go back to where they were in the 70's/80's - and people know which locations are desirable to live in, and which not. Hopefully, some decent thing will happen to all these miles and miles of giant tract homes.

[jim meehan]

The cycle continues - China, India the rest of the Pacific Rim have manufacturing problems, more efficient processes are established here, companies move their work to Calif (already happening), companies build up on cheap land in the Inland Empire and workers can afford to buy homes.

[Ed]

Well, the land speculators are taking a big bite out of a giant sh*t sandwich! Awww....I really feel bad for them. Like hell if I do! They raped and pillaged home buyers for too many years. THey have now reaped what they sowed....misery, just like the ones that overpaid and are now facing foreclosure. Now the speculators might have to give up a Beemer or two and (egads!!!) maybe have to drive an American made car! Maybe they can start a pity party club for the lot of them! Many tears in your beers, you greedy bast**ds!!

[Bob]

I wish California would fall into the sea.

[MyLessThanPrimeBeef]

I bet if the sellers in Inland Empire could afford $250,000 commission each an agent procures a buyer, the median prices would not have dropped so much.

[YOHANAN]

"So goes California, so goes the country"...isn't that right? Oh yeah, Maria Shriver and Swarz' have it all under control: You can't hide a Kennedy anywhere, they'll just blurt out something ridiculous, and we'll quickly recognize them by how ludicrous their words fit the situation were all in.

[paul]

It's sad to see what has become of the Inland Empire.When I was growing up in San Bernardino 40 years ago it was still a pretty nice place to live.I still miss the orange groves and vineyards.Not to mention the clear mountain views.I left when I realized the place was going to hell.I come back once in a while to see family and visit some graves,then I can't get away fast enough.Look what you liberal,gangbanging,illegal,out of touch people have done to my HOME!

[cas127]

"'Uh huh. Thank you. Yes!'

Clearly someone who has worked for a hedge fund, buying RMBS.

[YOHANAN]

To: C. Warbug...Yup, the burger flip'in jobs are all over the place, they even pay $7.00 an hour...Wow!

[predicted]

This artificial bubble was purposely engineered by the Federal Reserve. The Federal Reserve is private run for profit. Google Video, "Money Masters."

Oh, almost forgot, the corporate media is controlled by the same folks that run the Federal Reserve. That might be why you've never heard about this before. If you have, then you should thank the alternative ** cough ** real media.

[Mike]

You folks have no clue what you're talking about. I live in the IE, Murrieta to be exact, and I can tell you the reason there are "ghost towns" is the the greedy developers and land owners overbuilt on speculation that fools would continue to flock here. Our town grew from 42000 to 100000 in 8 years. Ridiculous, not to mention the surrounding cities and unincorporated areas. My area has 1 in ten hiome vacant due to foreclosure, mainly from people taking the equity out of their homes to but SUV's, boats and motorhomes. The devlopers are now hurting because their lack of reasonable devleopment, and so be it, I hope they never come back and the vacant lots remain that way for another ten years, These developers have left our communites with too much traffic, too many strip malls and no more small town feel. They've screwed up the place and hope they all go BK.

[bitterrenter]

racist, wannabe-armchair economists with no plan, hope or foresight.

[Bob]

The only thing missing from Inland Empire is jobs and shopping. It would have been fine as a planned community with a half dozen employers and that's the way to fix it.

This ongoing bailout of cheap government loans to the financial institutions who backed these projects is nothing more than a tax on savings and a tax on income. We call that tax inflation. It;s rampant and it's all because the govt keeps printing money. What we need is for the financial intitutions who can survive to be paying double digit interest to those who were frugal. Sure things will slow down but the frugal folk will take their money, pick up the bargains, let the junk rot away on it's own, and things will be hoping again in a few years. The high oil prices are a direct result of international loss of faith in the $ which is a result of printing too damn many of them...

[Eric]

They should allow the homeless to live in the empty homes.

[G Man]

The housing market was booming. It is trying to correct itself, which it always has done historically. The people that will suffer are the people that intentionally overextended themselves. It sucks. To be them, I mean.

When the market corrects itself houses will be sold at fair market prices and life will go on.

[G Man]

Oh...and like the housing markets...who do you think is driving the cost of oil? Thats right...speculators. Dont blame the Saudis...blame your 401K manager.

[tealeaf]

Something about this story has Johnny Dollar giddy.

I love it.

[Orangeman]

inland empire is east of los angeles - Riverside and San Bernadino Counties

[Buy Gold]

Same thing happening in the Pacific Northwest... I toured about 10 new single-family home developments in Greater Seattle about a month ago... the builders had basically vacated the projects... lots sitting empty... construction halted mid-way on some projects, no buyers, problem compounded by massive amounts of unsold inventory driving the market lower.

McCain/Cheney 08!
4 MORE YEARS!!!!

[Freddy]

"Hello?" " No speaky English?" " Un Huh?" "Thank you?" Nice how the flood of illegals has turned California into a sewer. Many gringos/anglos have left the emerging third world welfare country. The developers thought they could fill this cracker boxes with illegals with zero down loans and 1% ARMs.

[Henk]

"Look what you liberal,gangbanging,illegal,out of touch people have done to my HOME!"

Posted by: paul | July 02, 2008 at 03:47 PM

Wow, things are different in Califorian. liberal gang banging illegals don't build housing developements in the Mid-West. Mostly its greedy blood sucking Republicans.

[Harry Harrison]

Hahahaha, The arrogance on this page is funy. Anyone who actually lives in Southern California knows that Santa Ana is in Orange County and is an armpit comparable to Ontario.

Or Culver City is a beautiful place to live but don't ever say anything about the gangs and the gangwar with Venice.

You can throw a rock from Corona and hit "desirable" brea/yorba linda.

Beverly Hills? go a couple of blocks and you are in the ghetto.

How about El Monte? Nice, close to LA. Short commute.

Get real. Most of Southern California is close to areas you don't want to be in after dark. Only difference is that now you have the rural areas of new development skipping the thriving community stage and heading straight to urban blight.

[Ex-californian]

The good news: Soon all the illegals that framed and stuccoed these crappy little monopoly houses will be able to afford one. Ah, the American way.

[sfvrealestate]

Didn't we say this was going to happen? And didn't many posters here say "oh no no, prices just need to come down to a reasonable level...and well, then wonderful families like yours can buy, move in, fix up [ignore the predicted blight] and soon have wonderful, thriving communities for next to no money!" Yeah, right. The chickens are coming home to roost. And for those of you who will point out that I'm a Realtor and this is all my fault to begin with: I'm a Realtor, not a developer. I intentionally represent clients in areas where people have traditionally wanted to live, not areas where people have traditionally not wanted to live.

[AK]

Pass another gun-control law! Won't fix anything addressed in the articles or the posts...but hey, the folks you all elected in Sacramento will feel like they are doing ....something.... and you Kalifornians will have gotten your $$ worth..

Please stay the hell out of Colorado....fix your own house....

[J]

"the most undesirable and remote locations were worthy of expensive, high-end homes"

Amen to Ontario being undesireable and remote, but get a reporter familiar with the area - 565K is not an "expensive, high-end home" in California, even now.

[William]

How much did speculation hurt this project? It could have been a lot. Several years ago, I bought shares in a condo development project on the Gulf Coast. Things started out reasonably enough, but pretty soon, the shares were changing hands amongst new people, the speculators, sometimes daily. The prices shot up for an unchanged product. It got to the point where it looked to me like no one would buy at those prices, and mind you they were still going up, so I sold.

I didn't follow the project after that, aside from finding out the building I had invested in wasn't even built. The speculators had no interest in living in the building and the prices were so high, no tenants could be found. I've often wondered how the other projects faired.

[Jeff K]

12208 Braddock Drive

This is not really Mar Vista, Kind of a "Technicality" of sorts.

It's only 2 Blocks from the projects in a predominately Latino neighborhood that sprung up around them. Not surprising no one wants a million dollar house in that precise area.

[Happy Jack]

Bulldoze the whole sorry mess and return the land to it's natural state. This is a rare opportunity to reclaim what a developer has destroyed.

[Martial Law]

The horseleach hath two daughters, crying, Give, give. There are three things that are never satisfied, yea, four things say not, It is enough:
The grave; and the barren womb; the earth that is not filled with water; and the fire that saith not, It is enough.

[Cal]

They should just turn the IE into one big retirement community. Then gas costs won't be a factor and all those people in LA County who haven't saved for retirement can still arbitrage to a cheaper area instead of going to Texas or Arizona.

[Uncle Billy's Worried]

Horseleech? Wow, apt.

Poetic translation of the original hebrew in the proverb though. The word used is just "leech" which makes more sense because a horseleech doesn't suck blood according to this:

http://tinyurl.com/5jmm6o

[cdrmc]

I have no sympathy either for the fools who took out more debt than they could afford and bought overpriced housing, or the fools who extended the credit and are now going under.

I lived in SoCal in the early nineties and left because the housing was overpriced then.

I was able to obtain a +4000 sq foot house, a few hundred yards from the ocean, on 3+ acres, ten minutes from the center of a New England City at a fraction of the cost for a 2500 sq foot dump extending to the edge of the property in SoCal.

Nothing but a bunch of suckers out there

[T. Rogers]

Get real. Most of Southern California is close to areas you don't want to be in after dark. Only difference is that now you have the rural areas of new development skipping the thriving community stage and heading straight to urban blight.

Posted by: Harry Harrison | July 02, 2008 at 04:55 PM

Spot on!!! Thank you for pointing that out. I am guessing some of these posters have never actually driven around L.A. It only takes a few turns and your nice 'desireable' neighborhood has become the HOOD. Sure, I would never want to live in the Inland Empire. However, it it because of the distance. And truthfully there are parts of Corona and Rancho Cucamunga that are much nicer than some of the uglier parts of Culver City or Santa Monica. Let's stop being ignorant people.

[WeLeftLA4Mo]

My wife and I left LA in 05 we sold our house of twenty years in the Valley and got in our suv and found ourselves in the Missouri Ozarks where we purchased a fifteen acre hilltop and built a 3500 sq.ft. stone and wood type cabin we have clean air, a year round stream that comes out of the ground pure, and four seasons and are about half hour to Springfield for supplies, we will never live in Ca again we have lower taxes gas is under four bucks and English is spoken and no crime, ya it aint West Hollywood but we live so much better lives now, good luck out there.

[Keisha from San Berdo]

I grew up in the Rialto area before leaving to go to school in LA. The problem in the Inland Empire is the lack of jobs east of Ontario and the lack of competent city government officials who could not develop revenue or attract employers. The homes built during the late 90's and '06 were due to the overpriced homes in LA and Orange County. The trains that to help commuters get into Los Angeles, are the same price as a car payment and insurance. California needs to pay attention to other US metropolitan areas where suburban areas have public transit systems that are not cost effective.

My grandmother owns and lives in the home she bought in '79 and the other she bought in '65. The problem in the area is more related to the lack of employment in the area. If these issues are addressed the issue wouldn't be of a ghost town but would bring back the small town feel that another poster listed above.

PS. California has the highest air quality laws any where in the nation. While I grew up in smog alerts, it is NO way near the problem that existed in the 80s.

[Bill]

It happened in Texas in the mid 1980's because of the oil-Real estate bust, and noone cared about Texas. Now I can enjoy NOT caring about CA going down for awhile.

Bill - Plano Texas

[Bill]

I saw this in North Texas in the mid-1980's when the Oil-Ral Estate crash occured creating the RTC amoung others in the S&L debacle. Noone outside of Texas cared. I am enjoying not caring about this happening to California. I am enjoying it. What did you expect?

[john of sparta]

ok......you win......California loses.
empty spaces attract vermin.
Cali has plenty of both.
Next on FOX.

[yours truly, Johnny Dollar]

How many abandoned dwellings/shopping centers
equal how many new prison sites?
(do da math).

[JaneaneTheAcerbicGoblin]

I really liked David Lynch's Inland Empire.

Sorry, had to make that joke...

[chris]

Harry Harrison comment has it right. I haved lived in socal
nearly all my life and there are no nice areas anymore. from the beach to the top of cajon pass and beyond it all
sucks. I will be moving out of this state very soon. The liberals have destroyed it and the pussy republicans let them. The only thing left for this state is total implosion.
yea go east !!!

[W.C. Varones]

This is what Greenspan hath wrought.

We are tracking Greenspan's Body Count:

http://wcvarones.blogspot.com/2008/06/
greenspans-body-count-one-that-got-away.html

[Glen Gubernat]

So there are now "luxury" meth labs ready to move into now?

[AB]

I'm sure there is a problem selling houses right now, but hmm, it could be kind of hard to buy a house from someone that doesn't speak english, and most illegal aliens I've seen in CA that would be able to speak spanish can't afford a $350,000 house.

[Larry]

1991; Landcaster, Palmdale Apple Valley: Samething happened after dot com , areospace busts and baseclosings K&B and other developers were selling lott and plans, some were trenched, some were roughed in, some were poured, some partially framed were for sale and become ownerbuilders or get your own builder. there were thousands of these advertised in the times.

[branflakes]

With a projected rise in population of 10 to 30 million fore casted for the next 25 years, It is definitely time to buy again.

[shockg]

PUGTV(Fear Monger), Don't you have a bubble blog to run? Try all you want to influence the markets here. News flash: It doesn't work.

[Ted]

Years of corruption in California have led to this. The only thing holding the state together were big businesses paying big taxes, first in industry, then in technology and finance.

When those businesses decide to pack up and head for friendlier territory, it's going to be bad times for California. Seriously, when you have real estate prices in some places that are absurdly high and the property is smaller than my old college dorm room, there is a problem.

[MJ]

Barriers to entry are the obvious reason West LA and most coastal areas will hold up better than the rest. Proximity to employment centers, retail, and recreation are also key factors. There is always coastal demand so it is just a function of pricing. One thing people generally do not factor in for West LA and Coastal areas is the relatively minimal energy demands in houses in these areas. Rarely need heat or AC, so while other areas of the state and country feel additional strain from heating and cooling bills we will not. Also relatively low insurance rates and property taxes at 1.2% with 2% annual caps make all California real estate more attractive than other areas of the country.

[Ed]

Don't worry.As soon as the MESSIAH OBAMA is elected, all will be well.

[Mary Jo]

It's probably for the best. All those homes are in the path of a wildfires.......what with the dry chaparal etc.....they're all going to go up in flames anyway......c'est la vie !!!

[John]

Hey, Johnny Dollar! File any exciting expense reports lately? I miss listening to your show.

XM164

[Free Escalade]

Here's a winning idea - why not "incentivize" potential buyers with a free Escalade for every McMansion purchased in the IE dust bowl!

[Mike St James]

It's been twenty years since I've been to Southern California. I've watched the descent from afar, with sadness.

I will always remember the Golden State of the 60's. Fresh out of the army, I thought it was paradise, full of hope and energy. A place for dreams to be dreamed and realized.

I won't let myself dwell on what's become of California. It's too sad. Like Scarlett, "I can't think about that right now. If I do, I'll go crazy."

[Kip Carter]

Core Temecula is still a good, solid area in the IE. I know I have lived here for 19 years and seen it all. Give it a year or two and the folks that can't affort San Diego will be back driving up prices once again. Great raea Temecual.

[Venice Rises]

Harry Harrison, not to pop your bubble but Venice is on the rise. Ask realtors around here; the homes with a Marina Del Rey P.O. are listing as Venice properties for the extra attention and $$ they receive. Homes on the Venice canals, the former filthy hovels from 20 years ago, have current listings of 2.4 to 4 Million dollars. Interest in places like Venice is international, not local.
Oh, and I'm ready for California to secede from the US if it'll make you ditto-heads happy. We only have the 7th largest economy in WORLD. I hear Schwarzenegger is considering buying Michigan to get control of cheap American labor. They're not as uppity as the Mexicans.

[Hoosier]

I have lived in the Corona area for 30 years, and I love the city. The problem is that the Riverside County Stuporvisors allowed growth to be unlimited! In the new section of housing called Eastvale near Corona, the Stuporvisors allowed houses to be built about five feet apart and for the back yards to be too small to fit a swingset. Honestly, a kid would have hit the block wall that surround these tracts if he'd tried to swing. These monoliths started out at $165K about ten years ago and now go for up to $800K. The weirdest mix of people too, mulitple familes and businesses being run out of the houses. Don't get me started on the illegals buying houses! My friend, who lives next to Eastvale in Mira Loma, has fought off illegal rodeos, illegal churches outdoors with loud speakers, loud music (it's the culture, stupid!), people using discarded garage doors for fencing, cockfighting, etc. She USED to live in a decent rural neighborhood and now she lives in Little Tijuana because the feds won't do their job and keep these people OUT!!!

For two years now, my realtor has told me the only people buying houses in the IE were Mexican! That's because they were offering these low interest and no interest loans to those who can't understand what they are buying! They couldn't afford the houses to begin with. Good riddance to them I say.

Corona and the IE will come back, hopefully with few of the LA transplants bringing their gang families with them this time. Last downturn, they ruined Moreno Valley!

[craphound]

What has happened here in california is this greedy speculator's drove the prices to a unreal level as they did in the late 70's . Reality is comming sooner than we think . Dont think of your home as a piggy bank or retirement investment . It is a home nothing more . also the illigal aliens are being purged from home owership , and why should they own them , did anyone forget the illigal yhey broke the law getting here , have minimal skills and suck off the system , I for one do not want to reward bad behavior or law breaking , get ready for a reality re-adgustment in home values , welcome to reality , hope you enjoy it . In two years let's just see what a home is really worth . Have a nice day !

[Cook Barela]

You miss 1/3 the story. On the other side of the fence, where the build homes stand, many are vacant, some tract homes 1/3 of the block is bank owned. Foreclosures, and the other third well they are occupied by double families, sometimes three families living together in order to afford the huge mortgage payments and the gas to get to work.

Then again, there is more to the story then what the developer is losing, instead of $4-300,000.00 profit for each home sold, the builder is now only making $1-200,000.00 per home.

Cook Barela, Riverside

[Kip Carter]

Core Temecula is still a good, solid area in the IE. I know I have lived here for 19 years and seen it all. Give it a year or two and the folks that can't affort San Diego will be back driving up prices once again. Great raea Temecual.

[Robert Pratt]

Um, they wanted over $500,000 for a house clad in vinyl siding, with immature palms sort of providing shade in front of the ten foot red fence? And people were actually buying....uh huh.

I don't know who the sucker was, the person who actually bought a home with questionable water rights in the middle of nowhere, or the developer who thought it would never end.

Let the home's turn into gang slums. They will die of thirst out there.

I'd never pay more than $150,000 for a home of the quality of those displayed as new. Inner city, we'll talk about price, middle of desert, enjoy your 'investment'.

[Chewbacka]

All`s well that ends well. It matters not to me for whom the bell tolls.

[EllenO]

The unravelling of America one suburb at a time. Filled with questionable immigrants who cannot speak the language and exist on the periphery of middle America the tsunami starting in California will overwhelm the US.

In years to come prosperous Asians will look at the US and wonder how it could have once been so powerful in much the same we look at the Italians and think of the Roman Empire.

Isn't it sad that only young liberals and leftists who have pushed for this will be alive to see what their madness has wrought.

[Tim]

What's interesting about this news story is how clearly it reflects an absolute abandonment of our suburban economic model, and yet how many news outlets (Fox, CNN, etc.) would just chalk it up to a housing market 'correction' or a mortgage 'meltdown'. This are parts of the story but not the whole picture, and they are either too stupid or to willing to under-report the story to get this right.

The economic and demographic changes in the United States in the next 20 years will make your head spin. You may want to have an alternate country in which to live lined up, because none of our indicators look good.

The Bush Administration has nailed shut the coffin that our financial services companies have built.

Adios.

[HulaGirl]

Hmmmm. Frequent commenter Inland Empire has not weighed in on this discussion. Yoo-hoo..Where are you IE?

[Tim]

Liberals, liberals, liberals! Can't we blame them for everything?

Uhhhh, but wait, didn't the real estate free market give us this situation? Are you conservatives actually asking for URBAN PLANNING?

Sounds like you're not very consistent.

[Mr. Nut]

I lived in California for 50 years. I got out just before the housing market took a dump. I'm so gald I'm gone from that god forsaken place!

[kc]

THANK GOD.

Now let's mow down the empty tract homes & let it revert back to nature.

[anon]

The toilet bowl that is Los Angeles is now rimmed with scum from Palmdale to Coachella, Rancho Cowabunga to Chino Smells, Santa Ana to Garbage Grove, and Willowbrook to Watts.

My heartfelt apologies for leaving out Sun Valley, Monterey Park and El Sereno as well- most of it deteriorating as a direct result of Ted Kennedy's brilliant immigration theories and the incomparable Hart Cellars Act of 1965.

My heartfelt condolences to the victims of King Drew Medical Center, the Pasadena School District, and of course all current and future graduates of Academia Semillas del Pueblo.

Believe it or not, LA used to be run by people thinking more than 15 minutes into the future.

[Ctray]

Bob its guys like you that make life worth living.LOL!
I'll bet you all benefited when things were good. Remember when it was the thing to talk about at work, party etc? You weren't upset then were you, you little real estate tycoon? Well I hope you took the money. Now everybody is an economist with a degree in community planning sprinting towards retirement without equity(fear). The developer robots aren't the problem. Anyone of you would do the same if you had the brains or the cash (let alone desire). The ghost town is really not your problem or your business. Mind your own business and hope nobody realizes it was you all along (greed). I trust all you nostalgic idiots won't come to South Carolina. The first thing you will do is try to make things more like home(mexspencive). Of course that is your whole problem, and now mine.

If you must come, we drink milk not malk. That assumes you still have milk (from a real cow).

[Sam]

What's with Southern California? So many liberals.... so few cars in the carpool lane! Seems to be a bit hypocritical if you ask me. I visit often for business, and I can't believe a place that grew so large because so many free market entrepreneurs began businesses there could be so liberal? Maybe they should make economics a required course in high school and less people would say wheres mine? And even fewer would blame speculators for poor investments they made in certain housing markets. Free market capitalism is a fantastic thing, learn economics and you will understand the simple supply and demand. As far as the illegals go, blame the ultra leftists you elect.

[Ctray]

Kc
Things cannot revert back. Revert means to go back, so revert back would leave it in the same place. You comment it idiotic anyway.

[David]

All of you CA bashers are a bunch of idiots. I have lived all over the US and all things being equal would choose SoCal everytime. Sure it has some problems, but I'll take the great weather and the beach over...

Atlanta? hot, muggy, crime ridden
New York? Yea right
Dallas? Hot, crime ridden, and full of rednecks
Chicago? Nice winters...not
Detroit? Nuff said
Denver? You think SoCal polution is bad. Ha! Go live int he mile high city and you will change your mind.

Don't like the big cities? How about a nice little town in...

Oklahoma? Kansas? Nebraska? Ohio?

How about New Orleans, or Tampa, or Miami? Good grief people. Pull your heads out. If you don't like SoCal...then LEAVE.

I live in Temecula, and while we do have our share of housing problems, this is a fantastic place to live. We just moved back to SoCal from AZ and we are totally happy. I recall that the housing bust in the late 80's was just as bad and after all the bozo's left the state, things went back to normal.

Good ridance haters!

[RustyJohn]

Hey guys, instead of pointing fingers to the boogey man, why not look at the real reason for this mess and why we are paying $4.50 a gallon at the pump and 4 bucks for a dozen eggs.

The federal government has printed $4 trillion in new money over the past few years. This money has to go somewhere- it causes malinvestment and speculation- we had the dot.com bubble, the housing bubble, and the commodities bubble all within eight years.

Want to solve this problem? Balance the federal budget, stop printing money, restore value to the dollar or else in another couple of years we'll be burning money for heat like in the Weimar Republic.

Read Murray Rothbard's "America's Great Depression" and discover why we are headed into another one.

[CaliforniaGirl]

Wow all the bitter ex California residents - what da matter? Can't afford to move back from the stinky little towns that you thought would be your forever homes? Good!! Stay there in the extreme heat & the freezing cold.
You have the same problems there - only we are basking in the sun & you're not :)

[pugtv]

ShockG,

I'm only trying to help you promote your agenda. Where is the fear mongering in that?

Bitter comments against bloggers aren't effective. If you want the SoCal Real Estate prices to increase, you should go buy a house at a high price. As an alternative, you can sell options in the futures market at rates higher than today.

C'mon ShockG, prove to everyone you believe in your own agenda. =)

[DougBH, Dallas, Texas]

Use the Obama oil plan to solve this problem. Raise taxes on the home builders.

[CaptainVideo]

"Don't worry.As soon as the MESSIAH OBAMA is elected, all will be well."

No, but things will gradually start getting better. The Bush adminstration has made such a total mees of things that it will take many, many years to completely undo the damage. But the sooner we get started, the sooner we will get there.

To get things started, regulations of the financal markets, who caused this problem by running amuck, will be a helpful first step. Providing assistance to homeowners who cannot pay their mortages because they were mislead into taking on lonans they could not afford by unprincipled lenders will help. Universal health insurance so that people who get ill are not kept from making their mortgage payments by crushing medical bills will help. etc., etc., etc.

[JLM]

Like any imbalance between supply and demand this too will come into equilibrium. The only variables are time and price. The prices will have to come down and that will take time.

The real underlying economic considerations are the price of gas and the weakening of the US dollar. Energy is traded in dollars so when the dollar goes down there is artificial (real???) pressure for energy prices to go up just to regain/retain the true effective price of energy.

Dollar goes down, energy is priced in dollars, the price of energy has to go up.

In addition, California is now reaping the whilrwhind of its hugely uncompetitive cost structure of energy, electricity and labor.

People live in houses. People have to have jobs to be able to pay their home mortgages. Employers provide jobs where their capital can be used most efficiently.

California has a lot of work to do to regain its competitive balance in energy, electricity, labor, development, regulation, etc.

It will all come back into balance and it will only take time and money. The unwise will get burned. This is the way economies and economics work.

Remember NYC, the oil bidness, the RTC, the banking biz, etc. It all ultimately finds its footing.

[DavidC]

The LA Times can suck it!! Biased stories like this are why nobody out here in the land of "the dirt people" dont buy their paper. There are problems here, just like anywhere else and time will prove the author wrong...
Maybe they'll have the guts to write a counter piece to describe what is going well out here...

[Frank]

So exactly what alternative are you proposing. We should all line up to buy those 50 year old dopey 1500 sq ft domiciles in LA County for an even more dopey & rediculous high 6-figure price tag. No way, Jose!! I'll pay the $4.50 gas tab and save $1/2 Mil. Thank you very much.

[Jim in Vietnam]

The Inland empire will come back. Pent-up demand for housing in California (as well as the US) remains strong. But the home prices are going to have to drop sufficiently to provide any potential purchaser enough savings to pay out the huge commuting costs.

Bean-counters out there! Run a DCF analysis on fuel costs/house price and see if you can come up with a break-even point.

Go ahead and throw rocks at California. But if I return to the US that is the state where I want to return to. (But sure as Hell not to the IE!!)

[TSue]

David in Temecula...I'm right with ya...have lived outside the city limits (in the Temecula..unincorporated Riverside Co) in a more rural area now for 16 years. The positive side of the housing/market fiasco is that all the gangsters and illegals that have moved this way for affordable housing in the past 5-6 years are now the ones losing their homes and moving back to the urban blight from wence they came to be near jobs and or homies...whatever...all I know is foreclosed homes in my neck of the "inland" woods are now filling up with young, hard-working families and it's nice to see it!!

[troy]

I got an idea...instead of using FEMA trailors, why don't we use this community to house hurricane and even more recent, flood and fire victims and there families. It would probably cost us less in taxpayer money than the scams of these helpsul U.S. govt programs.

[HARIS]

wow! i must be a genius or some sort of wizard! i said to myself that such a thing would happen during the final months of the bush presidency. WoW! it is happening!
construction, cheap money, fraud, changing demographics. this all let to shitholes in the middle of the desert to be renamed and promoted as beautiful communities! i simply can not believe that so many people fell for this. really.....not a genius here....nor am i on cnbc or fox business, just a regular guy from the street and this was enough education to tell me to stand clear of this real estate phenomena and sit back and watch things fall apart. thank god i did not waste my time getting an MBA or higher degree. i made my millions though...in a previous real estate driven economy.....it taught me to buy and hold!!! the best bet with real estate investments is the inner city...within 8 miles of the cbd. all of a sudden temecula has become a suburb of L.A. and San Diego? current gas prices and the promotion of suv's killed that idea!

[Tiffany]

California is a nice place to live. People who don't live hear think every fire, earthquake and gun shot is all in Los Angeles. This problem has affected areas where speculation caused growth beyond the means of the average worker. A house in Corona selling for $565K. That's unreal. How many of those people own their own business (turning a profit) or a the local hospital? Very few could afford the area, but that was driven up by speculators.

I've lived in other states and California is the best place to live in my opinion. So many states are far worse off than California, at least our homes can accrue equity, there are some locations where the land is worth more than the house (Georgia, Ohio and Michigan are perfect examples of that). I've been searching real estate sites and I see the prices coming back down to where they should have been had not the speculators hijacked the market.

Another great aspect of California is that we do have the people and the resources to sustain growth without over hyping it. People move to California by the thousands and the metropolitan areas are out of space - once these homes in the Inland Empire begin to sell for the $200k's they will go fast.

Six months from now, when the prices drop another 30% I think it will be a good time to buy.

[Keith Paxson]

Raised in Chino in what is now called the "Inland Empire" in SoCal. Was like Mayberry back then, dairy farms and a small town atmosphere. I miss that place, not the one described in the article. Was in the first class that went all the way through Walnut Ave. Elementary School from Kindergarten to 6th grade. Good memories. Sad...

Shoot me an email to refi...

[Wrather]

Ohhh, p-oor, poor Communist Kalifornia, what a shame! i cannot WAIT until the "big one" comes along, and knocks the sinful, perverted, filthy, serial-killer infested state right into the ocean, and OUT of our lives forever. Yahweh is PUNISHING you, Communist FILTHY Kalifornia, for YOUR SINS, NO pity from me!! You were WARNED, PERVERTS!!

[Bill]

lots of folks need homes
price comes down ... people get mortgage and get keys

yawning at so cal ... oh god, a drought ... oh god, too much rain

yawn again ---- everything that has (is) happening is so freakin obvious --- yawn

[frayed]

How many "greedy developers" do you think physically forced any buyer to buy their home. Yea, I'm sure there were a lot of people too stupid to read the contract they signed and bought something they couldn't afford. And that is somone elses fault, because? The poverty pimps like Al, Jessie, etc. insisted that minorities and illegals were being discriminated against because they couldn't buy a house. So financial institutions were pressured to approve unqualified buyers with zero down, bad credit and not enough income. So, the mortgage companies sold the loans to high risk credit speculators who probably knew the swampthings in congress would bail them out. There is plenty of blame to go around for this mess but when something like this happens most roads lead to a dysfunctional, unaccountable, bloated, corrupt Federal government. Like the previous savings and loan bailout the taxpayers are the ones outlined by chalk.

[Pavel Penguin]

The Empire Strikes Out!!!

Don’t you just love the land of liberalism? If you are still drinking the cool aid this is how we got here:

1) Speculators thinking that real estate was the goose with unlimited golden eggs…and skies would never be cloudy again.
2) Legislation that forced lenders to make loans to people and communities that where “redlined and discriminated against”
3) Lenders taking advantage of people that in the past that where redlined and placing them in loans that they could not understand…
4) Our crazy policy of dictating a special gas blend because everybody in CA is so special
5) Not allowing any new refineries to be built in CA even though wonderful CA demands specials blends
6) Not allowing and drilling to ruin or pristine CA
7) Not allowing and new power plants…not in my backyard
8) A open border so that all state institutions i.e. schools, hospitals, police, etc, etc are overburdened
9) Hollywood & San Francisco telling the masses legal and illegal to just buy a Prius and that will solve everything even though the masses legal and illegal can’t afford it.
10) Hollywood & San Francisco bitching about people driving pickups … they expect the pool guy and gardener to fit their gear into a Prius
11) I quote the most learned gentleman who stated the following

“The place was the armpit of California 20 years ago when I left. The crime and the airpolution were unbearable. Where else could a law abiding citizen get shot at three times and have a gun pulled on them twice? I remember a few times times that a helicopter flew over with a loud speaker telling people to stay inside because the air was so bad.”

“This sentence said it all....the office worker who was NOT ENGLISH FLUENT. Last citizen out of California, shut the lights.”

I am sure that these surplus abandon housing will be utilized free of charge by …..

All I can say it was good ride…RIP California

Pavel Penguin ( a rambling ex California penguin who has had to much vodka)

[CallMeIshmael]

Marc S. said:

"These vacant homes will turn into once-in-a-lifetime buys for middle income families . You can't point to a single place in the U.S. where vacant new homes in the midst of a financial crisis did not eventually get sold to very grateful buyers or investors who appreciated the opportunity to buy distressed properties. Five years from now the buyers who sat on the sidelines are going to want to kick themselves for not jumping at the opportunity to buy NEW homes at below replacement cost."

Posted by: Marc S. | July 02, 2008 at 12:50 PM

Obviously Marc, you haven't lived long enough to have seen this movie before. I have. I'll tell you how this market is going to be cleared, with a bulldozer. Thirty years ago we were experiencing an oil related boom in the oil patch that resulted in crazy over development. When that oil bubble burst new luxury homes had to be bulldozed to get them off the market. The situation in California is far worse. What you have in Cali is mass psychosis which believes in the tooth fairy. And they say it with votes. Well, you get the kind of government you deserve. Now Gavin Newsome wants to run for governor. Perfect.

[Phil]

Let me see if I've got this right. They build a house whose true value is 200,000. They price it at 565,000 and can't sell it....DUH! Now they take the 200,000 house and price it at 375,000 and claim they are taking a 200,000 hit, and they STILL can't sell it...DOUBLE DUH!! Here's a novel approach all of you builders might want to try...Price the house for what it's worth and you might actually sell it!
WOW, what a concept!!

[Jigs]

Californicators. They'll make a wasteland of their own state and then, like a plague of locusts, move on and destroy yours too. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

[Sal]

America has always been a boom and bust country. Remember the stock market crash of 1929, the Oil bust of the 1980's, the internet bubble of the 1990's. We always come back stronger. The trillion dollar losses are soon forgotten and we continue to prove the doubters wrong. We will come back from this housing crisis, never bet against america because you will always lose.

[Terry]

You mean to tell me that because we have more houses than buyers that prices have come down???????

Well ........if that can happen with housing I bet if WE DRILLED FOR OIL AND BUILT REFINERIES the price of gas would come down too!

[edward]

What kind of crap civilization do we have. We go from one grifter debacle to the next in the financial sector; over-sized and disconnected housing developments; endless wars that accomplish nothing but to pile up unsustainable debt; but we got the lapel pins!.

[JJ]

"Harry Harrison, not to pop your bubble but Venice is on the rise. Ask realtors around here;"

LOLZ. Ask a realtor? You're kidding right. You can ask a realtor is buying a house in Baghdad is a good idea right now and he will tell you YES!!. In the mind of a realtor it is always a good time to buy everywhere.

Only a fool believes what a realtor says.

[bob]

Ctray-

Real Estate tycoon? No, I'm a physicist who never made more than $100K/annum yet managed to send two kids through private school from K-12 and am about to see them grad from college debt free.
1)I bought a house I could afford and paid cash. I got the cash by driving an old piece of crap ca and not eating out. I fixed up the 'bargain' house. No mortgage and crappy car but I had money to send kids to private school.
2)Economics is simple. More money chasing same crap = inflation = your money worth less. If you are swapping oil for camels, the exchange rate is about the same as it was 20 years ago. If you are swapping gold for oil, the exchange rate is the same as it was 20 years ago.
3)I drive a NEW car now. It's a NEW 1985 Honda that I got for scrap price because no one wants to work on 1980's emission controls. 28MPG, $28/year tag fee, $300/year insurance, $100 for a set of new tires, ...
4)I was not born knowing how to fix my own plumbing or car. I learned so I could save for retirement. Now the govt is diluting my savings like a 20's stock.

In nature, the ant eats the grasshopper. So it should be in a prudent economy.

[bob]

Atlanta is not crime ridden, unless you count metro Atlanta suburbs and the crime that occurs within a few small sub-cultures that pretty much keep to themselves.

Atlanta is not muggy. It's been beautiful all spring and summer.

The only problem with Atlanta is government corruption and high taxes. That's true moat places these days.

You can buy a 'repairable' house n a 1/4 acre lot within 6 miles of downtown in $10 - $100k range. I'm buing a few. Where else in the USA can you still do this? Houses in desirable intown neighborhoods are still appreciating. Condos are overbuilt and prices are dropping but they are no where near construction cost yet and last time this happened, those who bought at the bottom are still an easy 10X what they paid.

-Bob

[NY Bob]

Well gee. Here's a big hint. When it doesn't sell at $300,000 that means it's NOT WORTH $300,000. Face it, your state overvalued homes in the 2000s and now you're crying about it. I bet you can find a similar house to those in Kansas for $120,000.

I live in Lake Elsinore, CA. My house value has dropped due to a person bailing out and selling real short. I bought before the peak in late 2003. I am restructuring my