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EPA chief says Congress should pass greenhouse gases legislation

Responding to a U.S. Supreme Court order, Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Stephen Johnson said today that the Clean Air Act was "the wrong tool for addressing greenhouse gases" because it would be too costly to the American public, and said that Congress should move forward with passing legislation to tackle the issue instead.

The high court had ordered the EPA more than a year ago to determine if greenhouse gases were a danger to the public. If so, the justices said, under the Clean Air Act, the agency was required to develop regulations to reduce the risk.

Instead, Johnson signed what he said was an unprecedented 1,000-page document this morning that included letters from numerous White House environmental and economic agencies detailing how such regulations could harm major sectors of the economy.

"One point is clear," Johnson said. "The potential regulation of greenhouse gases under any portion of the Clean Air Act could result in an unprecedented expansion of EPA authority that would have a profound effect on virtually every sector of the economy and touch every household in the land."

He said he would accept comments on the proposed EPA regulations in response to the court order, but stressed repeatedly that it was the wrong approach because of the costs.

The document also includes a sharply revised version of a May draft by EPA staff members in which they concluded as much as $2 trillion in savings to consumers at the gas pump and elsewhere could be achieved if greenhouse gas regulations were implemented. That number was slashed to $830 billion, and the price of gas was calculated at $2 a gallon for the next 30 years. EPA press secretary Jonathan Schradar said he did not know why the numbers had been changed, but said extensive review of the earlier draft had been performed by agency staff members.

Today's announcement once again effectively eliminates any likelihood of the Bush administration regulating greenhouse gases.

-- Janet Wilson

 
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As for CO2. First, it does not and cannot cause additional green house warming. Why? Because there is a limit to the amount of heating that can result from energy absorption at the wavelengths that CO2 absorbs from the suns radiation. Heating decreases logarithmically as CO2 concentrations increase. That is to say that if an increase in CO2 from 100 to 200 ppm resulted in a 1 degree C increase in atmospheric temperature, it would take an increase of CO2 to 1000 ppm to cause an additional 1 degree increase. Second, who is to say what the correct or ideal level atmospheric CO2 is? We know that it has been much higher in the past than it is today. We also know that it would be a disaster if it were suddenly half of what it is now: we would all be dead within a year.

Why is this? First, CO2 is not a pollutant and does not cause pollution. The judge that made this ruling is a moron. CO2 is a vital nutrient to all photosynthesizing plants. A CO2 concentration below 250 ppm, at cooler temperatures is nearly fatal to plants. Research has shown that for food crops, the ideal CO2 concentration is between 750 and 1500 ppm. At these concentrations, plants grow faster, yields increase; they require less fertilizer and water. Ask someone with a greenhouse it they add as much CO2 to their building as they can afford to increase yield. It turns out that oxygen is a poison gas to plants. Replace a plants CO2 with oxygen and the plant dies. Replace the plants oxygen with CO2 and the plant thrives.

My God, what a pathetic lot you Americans are, when it comes to Climate Change, blame evrybody else but yourselves. You just love yourselves and think that you are right and everybody else is wrong. Communist China may have robbed you of the nr 1 spot when it comes to country CO2 emissions, but you still remain up there as Nr 1 per capita, yet you still continue as if nothing is happening. However carry on as you are, and one day, in the not to far distant future, C C will hit you in a way you just cant imagine.

Bush bashing began several years ago by a far left outsider by the name of George Soros. Mr. Soros has a dark agenda for our country that he is promoting by manipulating our Democratic Congress. People picked up on this malicious bashing of President Bush quickly, in part to sooth wounds created by the impeachment of President Clinton. Concerning Iraq, every major event in the history of mankind has been accomplished in Iraq, including the present conflict. Become seriously involved and do your homework and you will understand why the U.S. is there today. Our nation is the leader against terrorism. Instead of showing pride in our country, some are damning our country, much to their shame. The environment will cease to be the man-made giant consumer of government funding and will become much less important in the near future.

Bush bashing began several years ago by a far left outsider by the name of George Soros. Mr. Soros has a dark agenda for our country that he is promoting by manipulating our Democratic Congress. People picked up on this malicious bashing of President Bush quickly, in part to sooth wounds created by the impeachment of President Clinton. Concerning Iraq, every major event in the history of mankind has been accomplished in Iraq, including the present conflict. Become seriously involved and do your homework and you will understand why the U.S. is there today. Our nation is the leader against terrorism. Instead of showing pride in our country, some are damning our country, much to their shame. The environment will cease to be the man-made giant consumer of government funding and will become much less important in the near future.

Compact-fluorescent light bulbs CAN BE VERY DANGEROUS!!!

Read:

Mercury leaks found as new bulbs break--The Boston Globe.

...Even cleaning up the dust from a broken bulb can be very dangerous...

Here consider how the Wall Street Journal reported that carbon monoxide, particulate, and sulfur dioxide emissions have been greatly reduced here in the US--since 1970; "All of this has been accomplished despite a doubling of the number of cars on the road and a near tripling of the number of miles driven ..."

Yet, another WSJ article explains how: "A significant portion of China's air pollution can be traced directly to the production of goods that are exported. In the City of Shenzhen, a major industrial base in southern China, about 89% of emissions of sulfur dioxide, an air pollutant that causes acid rain, are released in the process of export manufacturing ... The study also found 71% of particulate matter, the small particles that cause smog and respiratory problems, can be traced to the manufacturing of exported goods."--China shifts polllution fight, 11/01/07.

"If you have emission constraints, it's become very attractive to relocate dirty production to developing countries ... You import the finished goods, and leave the pollution in China." Why China Could Blame Its Co2 on West, WSJ, 11/12/07.

"Mercury and other pollutants from China's more than 2,000 coal-fired power plants soar high into the atmosphere and around the globe ... The US EPA recently reported that a third of the country's (USA) lakes and nearly a quarter of its rivers are now so polluted with mercury that children and women are advised to limit or avoid eating fish caught there. ... Some scientists now say 30% or more of the mercury settling into US ground soil and waterways comes from other countries--in particular, China."--Invisible Export--A Hidden Cost of China's Growth: Mercury Migration, WSJ, 12/20/04.

Note GreenPeace and the Sierra Club have links to inexpensive mercury testing kits...

Naturally, Obama and McCain are huge advocates of COAL...

Read:

Nader opposes nuclear, coal, oil energy, supports wind, solar--Crosswalk website,

The Dirty Truth About Clean Coal--BusinessWeek, 06/19/08,

Real Solutions for Reducing Carbon Emissions--Rain Forest Action Network,

King Coal's Latest Con Job, Clean Coal is Not Clean--CounterPunch, 01/23/07.

Note: The Colossal Magnet Levitation Wind Turbine = $.01 per kilowatt hour (plus its low-center-of-gravity = perfect for offshore wind farms = unlimited potential).

Hemp is an environmentally safe source of Ethanol, which could easily replace coal and oil in power plants, though, where 100% Ethanol burns pure, when mixed with gasoline (E85) for cars, this actually causes more pollution!!!

Read:

Ethanol vehicles pose significant risk to health, new study finds, Stanford Study, Stanford News Service, 04/18/07.

Even though "Toyota Chief Executive Katsuaki Watanabe confirmed to BusinessWeek that the company would put high-capacity lithium-ion batteries in the third generation Prius, due toward the end of 2008 or early 2009," one shouldn't hold his/her breath here...

Consider how public perception of the lithium-ion battery was smeared by Sony's massive recall--all because of contamination caused by an inferior manufacturing process!!! ...Part of the conspiracy to Muder the Electric Car...!!!

Note: The Tesla Roadster already uses a lithium-ion battery.

According to Wikipedia, Electric Vehicles--the lithium-ion battery takes minutes instead of hours to charge, and a single charge goes as far as a tank of gas.

...How difficult to make a car with a battery-pack easily changed at a servcie station, and a small emergency battery-pack that a tow truck could provide...?

Finally, consider how Pres. Bush never actually won a Presidential Election: See The US Commission on Civil Rights Report on the Irregularities of the 2000 Florida Presidential Election (Executive Summary), and the Rolling Stone Magazine article titled Was the 2004 Election Stolen?

Then complain to the United Nations Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights about our corrupt election process: 1503@ohchr.org

1. It would never pass with the required 60 votes in Senate.
2. Bush would veto it.
3. Bush would gut and neuter any such legislation with an
infamous Bush Signing Statement.

So, let me get this straight. Johnson is complaining about the "financial impacts" to all of us, which appear to be over $2 trillion in SAVINGS, which we can safely triple, since they falsely deflated the price of oil at $58 and it is just about triple that now. Oh, then we have to factor in the massive health effects that Dead-Eye Dick Cheney had removed from the EPA reports, which would have shown the incredible costs in human suffering and medical expenses if we fail to act, so for an estimate, we should probably double the savings from taking action again.

Wow, with impacts like $12 trillion in savings, we really ought to be scared of this kind of regulation. How will we survive if Big Oil, Big Pharma and Big Weapons Dealers are cheated out of their rightful $12 trillion?

"There's no energy shortages." Chris (below)

True enough. There's enough insolation in CA to power the place with googol's of MW to spare, surf and wave power too, for that matter. And I don't think fusion is hopeless, tho it's obviously difficult to effect. But talk is cheep. It takes social stability and cooperation to bring all this about, something we're sorely lacking. People need to wake up and cut the nauseating all pervasive bs permeating the society.

I'm not going to proclaim that the sky is falling but.. honestly.. at this point there is virtually total consensus in the scientific community that global warming is a reality. There is also virtually total consensus in the scientific community that smoking causes cancer. Is it the practical implications of the former proposition that make it so much more unpalatable than the latter? I think so.

I don't care for more/bigger gov. At this point though, I'd rather my future and my children's future be placed in the hands of the gov. than corporate oil interests. For those of you who care only about money and our economy let's think of it this way. We're now importing 70% of our oil, that's 700 billion dollars a year being exported to foreign governments (most of which are hostile to the US). The EPA would do well to step up and do its job. Johnson apparently has his head too far up GWB's arse to do the right thing.

If you poop in the well often enough, eventually you'll have to go get a drink. Problem is, I have to live on the same planet, with the same well, as Mr Johnson, and Mr Bush.

I'm not going to proclaim that the sky is falling but.. honestly.. at this point there is virtually total consensus in the scientific community that global warming is a reality. There is also virtually total consensus in the scientific community that smoking causes cancer. Is it the practical implications of the former proposition that make it so much more unpalatable than the latter? I think so.

I don't care for more/bigger gov. At this point though, I'd rather my future and my children's future be placed in the hands of the gov. than corporate oil interests. For those of you who care only about money and our economy let's think of it this way. We're now importing 70% of our oil, that's 700 billion dollars a year being exported to foreign governments (most of which are hostile to the US). The EPA would do well to step up and do its job. Johnson apparently has his head too far up GWB's arse to do the right thing.

Interesting that the Supreme Court decision yesterday was unanimous. The article didn't really get into the law involved. The law in a case like this usually falls on some esoteric technicality. I see two issues here: The first is that the vast majority of people on both sides of the political debate (earth vs. money) don't understand the science involved. The science is complicated - and this frustrates people, because we want easy answers. People please, don't pretend like you know the science or pretend that your views are justified by the science. Let the scientists sort it out...it's going to take a while.

The second issue is that the politics involved is as dirty as the air we now breathe. That part anyone can understand. The E.P.A. is a joke and the Bush Administration should be held up to ridicule. Don't be as stupid with your interpretation of the politics as you are with the science - the politics of greed and ignorance are plain to see.

It's incredible to think that the term flatearther is used by posters to describe people who question a scientific theory. It's a perfect example of how they just repeat and think what they have told.

Just as the earth changes and has been for thousands of years it's obvious that the gullibility in humans has not. Green- by the way, is a synonym for being naive. A very appropriate term for describing this latest movement.



If it means that I will have to live less extravagantly so my son will have air to breathe when he's an adult, then so be it. I can't wait for all of these money-grubbing old-fart republican "conservatives" to be out of the way of real progress on our environment.

The part that bothers me the most about this is that the EPA was ordered to come up with a solution over a year ago. Rather then develop that solution, their time was spent developing a document telling the court why they shouldn't do what they were ordered. $2 a gallon for gas? Do you know oil was at $44 a barrel when W took office? Now a gallon of heating oil goes for $4.39 and the companies won't lock you in because they don't know how high it is going to get. Gas has doubled, the price of oil has climbed 3.5 times itself in the last 7 years, and none of the money is going to making the climate or any other situation this administration has ignored better. Exxon makes over 200k a minute and I can't afford to heat my house this winter or drive to work this summer. Real change? Magnetic propulsion - it is a 0 pollution, 0 friction, energy source.

Big Surprise! George Bush and his administration prove, one more time, that their imperial arrogance goes beyond the hubris of ANY administration in living memory, including the many rather bizarre trips through the looking glass by the infamous Reagan IN-Justice Department.

One more time, these gallant lads and ladies of the royal cabinet go to great lengths to let, "we the people, " know exactly where we stand in the modern scheme of governance. The irony here is as blunt and heavy as a scene of divine justice in a Shakespearean study of royalty and power. Mene, Mene, Tekel Uparshin ... indeed!

Question: What happens when regulatory agencies don't regulate and governments don't govern? Answer: Read the newspapers for your edification.

To Chris:

If you think that CO2 is "harmless," I suggest you lock yourself in a room with only this "odorless natural product of breathing" and see what happens. For the sake of argument, while an overabundance of CO2 may arguably be good for plants on the most simplistic level, I don't think an overabundance of it would be good for any animals, or even other environmental processes. How about that old adage, too much of anything is bad"?

I agree! If there is NO PLACE to live, it doesn't matter what the price is!! We cannot PUT a price tag on species' lives when it depends this greatly on the decision of the few elitists who decide who lives and when.

Wow. Finally, a good decision from EPA. It's about time. Now, open up off-shore drilling and Anwar. Start building nuclear plants and new hydro-electric dams. Lastly, expand solar and wind power generation. Do it all, not just one. It's the only way to reduce fuel prices in the long run. As for issues related to global warming and air polution, get a clue... finances drive change and there's no reason to change. There's no energy shortages.

The idea that carbon dioxide is "harmful" is a joke. It is not harmful at all: it is odorless, is a natural product of breathing, is essential for plant life (and, in fact, there is a lot of evidence that suggests an increase in CO2 is beneficial for plants), all of which suggests that it is absurd to regulate CO2. Congress wants to regulate CO2 mainly because it is the only way by which it can tax us for breathing. Good grief.

Here's what I've decided is really going on. The whole point of all the "global warming isn't happening" proclamations and then all of the "okay it might be happening but we'll need to study ways of fixing it for 20 more years before we do anything" talk is what global warming makes possible for the oil companies/investors.

When all the easy oil is going, going, gone but there's gobs and gobs of it in the arctic made inaccessible because of all that ice ... do you really expect the oil companies are going to do anything but fight any potentially successful effort to slow global warming down? There isn't anything EXCEPT global warming that can get them what they want.

Global warming is a hoax based on junk science. It saddens me that so many Americans have become sheep, just following along with whatever they hear on television. I think Marx called people like you useful idiots. At least the Bush administration has had the good sense to hold up efforts to reglate co2 emmisions.

Should Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger consider a fee on corn fuel ethanol use?


* * Lower price for food, gas, water, beer, cleaner air and funds for the budget from oil profit.


What was the cause of death of Alexander Farrell, 46, expert on alternative fuels?

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/04/18/BAOK1087DP.DTL

According to the GOP we don't have to worry about the planet anyway because Jesus is coming down and flying all the good Republicans up to heaven.

Man these flat earther's need to go.

Fact: If you smoke in a room with no windows and no doors, it will get smoky, and you will cough. You may even get sick. What if the room has the best filtration system ever? Doesn't matter if you put an increasingly infinite number of people smoking in it.

Fact: The earth is just such a room and we should quit smoking. Even McCain knows that smoking kills people.

Clearly the economy has to be considered, but the health of the planet and it's living beings have to be the top priority in dealing with the greenhouse effects. This country MUST stop putting profit before the wellbeing of the people and the planet. The world is watching and we are falling further and further behind in dealing with this problem. We use the lions share of natural resources and produce more than our share of the pollution. It's time we step up, take responsiblility and clean up our mess.

Wow, that's quite a stance to take.

The Supreme Court tells you, "You must regulate greenhouse gases."

EPA says, "No way, too big of an issue for me."

The problem is the FACTS that we have to day contradict the findings from Kyoto, Japan in December 1997. So based on their findings, they can't regulate because the only thing that carbon dioxide does is make plants greener. In a greenhouse they have to pump in co2 or the plants die in the winter.

The Facts:
http://www.petitionproject.org/gwdatabase/Article_HTML/Review_Article_HTML.html

We need a new name for the EPA, since they're no longer protecting the environment. It's tempting to call them the "Environmental Plundering Agency," but those are slanted words that are no more accurate than its REAL name.

How about the "Environmental Politics Agency?" It comes much closer to what actually happens there.

Cecil:

All their pollution are belong to us. Seriously, not only has the US off-shored jobs, but we've off-shored our pollution. Companies go to where the not only is the labor cheap and unregulated (sweatshops) but the environmental regulations are lax.

Boy, I'll bet a lot of Americans wish higher CAFE standards would have been implemented long ago, so that at > $4 per gallon gas, they wouldn't be paying so much.

'Course, being a wacko environmentalist, I bought a Prius almost 5 years ago, so I've been saving on the gas bill for quite some time.

Interesting how the left despises common sense and logic.

"Too costly for the companies that produce the greenhouse gases. "

Corrected his mis-spoken quote.

Bush appointed a crony to the EPA. I cannot wait till November. His damage to the WORLD will prove to last a century if not longer to undo.

Stephen Johnson is an incredibly brave man. This was the HUGE opportunity for the EPA to become a strong, encompassing, pervasive organization. In the guise of the EPA, the government could have an air quality test site in every city. With happy little men in black waving their air testers about, fining trucks, cars and businesses everywhere. But Johnson passed this opportunity to become the head of a really huge organization. Well done, Mr. Johnson !

Thank God the wacko enviormentalist did not win this set back to civilization. If you want to help, target the largest polluter on earth, China. Most bang for the buck there.

Such a disgrace and disaster is the Bush administration and legacy.

out with the bum....

Well.. well. Politically, sure should remind us of the end of the last administration. Passed on Kyoto, passed on increasing CAFE standards, passed on removing mercury and arsenic from the air and water, passed on a national energy policy, passed on warning us that millions would loose their jobs and the country would go into a recession from the bubble and corporate corruption collapse, passed on putting the inspectors back in Iraq - but stepped up the bombing, passed on coming to the aid of the Afghanistan people as the Taliban routed the coutry, passed on addressing the global HIV/aids pandemic in Africa, passed on addressing the plight of millions loosing their lives in civil war and genocides in Africa (Congo, Sierra Leone, Ivory Coast).

We are here talking about costs, but let me ask you. Who gives a flyin hell about cost, or currency if we all die from super massive tornado's, tsunami's, hurricaines, and everything else under the sun. Rising water levels mean more bugs spreading disease, and potentially the next airborne virus's. Seriously, think before you talk.

Faithful to the oil/gas/energy industries to the last, the Bush Administration will get its reward from them.

They concluded as much as $2 trillion in savings to consumers at the gas pump could be achieved if greenhouse gas regulations were implemented?

Of course they did. I'll bet they neglected to factor in the taxes involved in implementing and regulating such draconian restrictions. I'll further guess that they ignored the massive subsidies (more taxes) to manufacturers and buyers of these silly, unprofitable new "technologies" that don't make money and require regular injections from our wallets to stay propped up.

If you think something is expensive, wait till you see what it costs when Congress makes it "cheap".

Hardly unexpected considering this administration has the worst environmental record in history. While other generations are labeled, "The Greatest," ours will be labeled "The Most Selfish and Self-Centered." We are armed with information that our planet could actually be doomed yet we choose do do nothing about it because we refuse to make little sacrifices in our daily lives. (Note: redacted portions of the EPA report state that TRILLIONS would be saved if we regulated under the Clean Air Act.)

t seems as if the Bush administration was only content to lead us into a war, as opposed to leading us out of environmental disaster. Disgusting.

Are you KIDDING? Gas at $2 a gallon used as the basis for financial calculations on cost/benefits of regulation? This is shameful abuse of governmental authority and bald-faced lying to the American public and the highest court in the land. Unbelievable. How soon does this guy leave office? And how can his EPA flunky sleep at night?

What more would you expect from this do nothing agency? Johnson is simply a lap dog for for the Bush/Cheney oil interests that run this country.

Can't wait for Bush to get out of the way, but I am certainly glad that the government is telling us gas with be at $2 per gallon for the next 20 years.

This seems like a bad joke.

Considering how much this administration censors their scientists, and only uses those who 100% agree with their crazy ideology...why would we believe anything the corrupt EPA says? "Too costly for the public." I don't think you can put a price tag on actually having a place to live...who gives a crap about the economy when you can't have an economy without a friggin' place to live?

They need to look at the real issues and facts. The earth's atmosphere in no way resembles a greenhouse.

http://www.junkscience.com/Greenhouse/

It really points to WATER, duh, take a look at the abuse we are inflicting on our oceans!


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