Details on why 'Moneyball' couldn't get to second base

Patrick Goldstein of The Times has a long follow-up on the saga of the shelved "Moneyball" movie, including an interview with the shelver, Sony's Amy Pascal. Here are some excerpts:

"I've wanted to work with Steven forever, because he's simply a great filmmaker," Pascal told me today. "But the draft he turned in wasn't at all what we'd signed up for. He wanted to make a dramatic reenactment of events with real people playing themselves. I'd still work with Steven in a minute, but in terms of this project, he wanted to do the film in a different way than we did."

Soderbergh's last-minute revisions represented a huge change from the shooting script I read when I was working on a story about the film during its pre-production. The script, written by Oscar winner Steve Zaillian, was a baseball movie, but it was loaded with great comic moments and dazzling dialogue that captured the frenetic energy of Beane, a strikingly good-looking former phenom who washed out after a brief stint in the majors, only to resurface as a general manager who operated more like "Entourage's" Ari Gold than the buttoned-down insiders who normally run big-league teams. Beane was a born hustler, always wheeling and dealing, staying one step ahead of his rivals as he scouted unlikely unknown minor leaguers to replace the high-priced free agents a small-market team like the Oakland A's couldn't afford. ...

Soderbergh wouldn't talk to me about all this, but it seems clear that he became obsessed with authenticity, replacing many of Zaillian's inspired scripted set-pieces with actual interviews with the real people who were involved in the events. The Soderbergh aesthetic, according to one source close to the film, was simple: If it didn't happen in real life, it wasn't going to be in the movie. That might make for an intriguing art film, but it clearly was no longer a film that any studio would spend $58 million to make, especially with baseball films having virtually no appeal outside of the U.S. ...

... Studios get nervous when directors say "Trust me." Sony was especially concerned, wondering if the end result would be one of Soderbergh's "experimental" films, like "Bubble" or "The Girlfriend Experience," not one of his more polished gems, like "Out of Sight" or "Ocean's Eleven." For now, the project remains in limbo, with Sony having sunk nearly $10 million into the film already. The studio still needs to find out whether Pitt, who is intensely loyal to Soderbergh, will stay with the project. As Pascal put it: "We really hope we can still make this with Brad Pitt."

Sony would also have to find a new director who is not only a good fit for the material but would pass muster with Pitt, who has director approval on his films. To find a director with enough stature or buzz to attract Pitt won't be easy. The most likely options would be for the studio to go in more of a comic direction -- possibilities being Jay Roach or Jason Reitman -- or toward a more dramatic choice, like Gary Ross or even George Clooney, who is putting the finishing touches on a two-year production deal with the studio. ...

... I'd still say that makes "Moneyball" a longshot. Or to put it in baseball terms, this is a project that will need to stage a big late-inning rally to put a win up on the scoreboard.

Comments

[dodgerkramer]

you know what's scary?

Jason Marquis will be pitching against the American League's best in St. Louis, trying to help the NL earn home-field advantage in the World Series. Sigh.

Did you see Soriano is 4th among NL outfielders? and Victorino is 5th? what a joke!

[chex]

did Scully just say Gonzalez will be "put to the acid test"?

[Craig88USC]

The Chaderator!
K
K
K
K
K
K
K
K
K

[Jon Weisman]

Rare to see someone complain Martin isn't catching enough.

Martin leads the major leagues in innings caught.

http://tinyurl.com/mzvoc3

[OhioVic]

Big K #9

[Gen3Blue]

I can't imagine Moneyball becoming a movie myself. But I have trouble with many stories translation to film. I sure hope I never have to see "Walk in the Woods". It is almost as bizarre as being unable to hit Rockies pitching!

[underdog]

Thanks for the wrap-up on why Moneyball got stuck, Jon. Interesting behind the scenes stuff.

Bills really deserves a win in this game but that's baseball. And it's far from over!

[dodgerkramer]

I repeat...Billingsley is NOT an ace.

[Hollywood Joe]

"Rare to see someone complain Martin isn't catching enough. "

Jon, you should know better than anyone that if you hang out at DT long enough you will hear complaints about team you could have never imagined

You could give us a bunch of free ice cream and sure enough some of us would be complaining about plastic spoons, others would decry the lack of sprinkles, and the most adament would take this as a chance to critque the dairy industry and go into a long polemic on the merits of soy based foods

[underdog]

Drat!

At least they got the runner at 3rd.

I wouldn't be too worried if the Dodgers had shown any signs they could do anything at all against Marquis. So far they have not. But here's hoping that changes.

[Bob Hendley]

Uggh.

[Craig88USC]

Jason Marquis can flat out hit.
He missed his calling imo.

[Bluebleeder]

all it takes is one swing of the bat & 2 runners on...

[OhioVic]

Too bad. He was 1 strike away from getting out of that against Iannetta.....

[Brent Knapp]

If I was playing left field two runs would not have scored on that last base hit. What percentage of DT readers can make a better throw than Pierre just did?

[dodgerkramer]

Aces get the big outs when they need em, Hollywood.

Aces don't give up 2-run singles to a pitcher in a 1-0 game.

Sorrry, they just don't.

[Package]

Jon, are you speaking of me?

[Bob Hendley]

I, myself, would demand napkins.

[ucladodger]

I guess turnabout is fair play. That one hurts. Chad needed to put Iannetta away when he was up 1-2, but he couldnt control the slider and cutter on 3 straight pitches

[Michael]

Is Billingsley an All-Star? He's really been struggling lately.

[Craig88USC]

dodgerkramer - have you ever read Jon's rules? Top right corner.

[ucladodger]

Kramer, thats just silly. Would you consider Johan Santana an ace? He also gave up a grand slam to Felix Hernandez.

[superbas]

why did billz throw 4 straight balls to ianetta after getting up 1-2? he couldn't touch billz stuff.

[Jon Weisman]

Did I misinterpret?

I agree dodgerkramer, trouble is, Joe won't play that lineup enough. He is obsessed with rest.

Posted by: Package | June 30, 2009 at 08:27 PM

underdog, did you see Ellis lose where the baseball was? That's why Martin needs to be in there.

Posted by: Package | June 30, 2009 at 08:34 PM

[Mannyman]

Guys, I'm at the game. Grandpa Elliot just had the place rockin with a great rendition of "God Bless America." I've never seen anyone carry a crowd here the way he just did.

[ucladodger]

Package, how in the world would any watcher stop that ball? It was a 58 foot curveball that bounced over Ellis' shoulder (he was positioned correctly) and hit the umpire. Ellis had absolutely no chance, and neither would have Russell.

[ucladodger]

watcher should say catcher.

[dodgerkramer]

Craig: Which rule did I break this time?

[Bluebleeder]

i was hoping we'd get to there pen but at this pace he's gonna pitch a complete'o'mundo. sigh.

[Package]

Hollywood Joe
You should also know that if you hang out with DT long enough that there wouldn't be room for lively debate or disagreement. Only agreement and saying everything is always just lovely, and talking about things that have no impact on the Dodgers.

[Craig88USC]

Well we still got 6 outs to go -

Just need a couple baserunners in the 8th and 9th.

No way that 3 runs is impossible to get back this season...

[Brent Knapp]

I have never given up a two run single to a pitcher. I am, therefore, an ace.

[underdog]

1) Martin has muffed balls in the dirt quite a few times this season. And I still love Russell Martin. But sometimes he needs to sit. AJ Ellis is considered a very good defensive catcher.

I also, I say again, sitting Hudson and Martin tonight before an early day game tomorrow is not only not madness, it's pretty rational. Both guys have looked tired, very tired lately. I love O-Dog too but haven't you been watching him lately?

2) Also, kramer and michael, This is struggling? 3 runs in 7 innings, with, what, 9 Ks? If the Dodgers had mustered any offense Bills would be in line for a deserved win. Any scout in baseball will tell you that Billingsley is one of the top young pitchers in baseball.

In case you missed it, Tom Verducci of SI put Bills on his NL All-Star pitching staff: http://bit.ly/FRPzj

This reminds me of the irrational stuff about Broxton which, lo! We don't hear as much of anymore, thankfully.

Honestly, I'm about ready to take the night off from here. There is some incredibly irrational stuff coming out that I know has to do in part with the Dodgers offensive struggles as of late. But really now.

[Jon Weisman]

Package, I don't think Joe is saying you have to agree with him or say everything is lovely.

I don't understand - do you really think there isn't enough Dodger conversation here?

My saying that a complaint about Martin not catching enough is rare - was that some form of censorship?

[Ollie]

that soudns amazing mannyman, unfortunately on kcal we got to see a terrible audio version of take me out to the ball game, and not god bless America.

[underdog]

11 strikeouts for the pitcher in question.

[Craig88USC]

K K K K K K K K K K K Bills

[Jon Weisman]

I will say - and this is certainly open for debate - that even in this 49-28 season, there's been a tendency that whenever anything goes poorly for the Dodgers, to blame the Dodgers and not give credit to the other team. And that doesn't seem right to me.

But again, questioning why some people feel the way they do is not the same thing as denying them the right to feel that way.

[Ollie]

by the way, Grandpa Elliot was in this "stand by me" mash-up/collaboration, and is by far the best version I've ever seen.

http://tinyurl.com/d3snwc

[Michael]

underdog, it's not so much tonight's performance by Chad, but what he's done in his last two starts against the White Sox and Angels. To me, he just doesn't look like the same pitcher he was earlier in the year.

[underdog]

Package, I'm just trying to have an honest debate with you about what I thought was a false statement you made, that's all. Since we've both been allowed to argue it openly I'm not sure where the cries of censorship are coming from. Should I not be disagreeing with you?

Why is it okay for you to post statements but some of us disagreeing with you means that Dodger Thoughts does not accept opposing viewpoints? What am I missing?

Honestly, I am as upset as you or anyone that the Dodgers offense has gone south lately, though I still have tremendous confidence that it won't last much longer. But it is still frustrating. There are things maybe I'd do differently. I don't see how us feeling these ways means we think everything is hunky dory.

[Hollywood Joe]

I love debate and learn much here

I value opinions that are significantly different from mine

I appreciate arguments that have some frame of reference based in either data or observation that is meaningful.

By meaningful, I am not ruling out the subjective, but I have a hard time understanding arguments that go completely in the face of widely understood data, or arguments that are based on purely the last experience (ie - he gave up a hit, thus he is not an "ace")

I am cranky, but not a crank

[dodgerkramer]

So what I gather is, everyone here calling Bills an ace is pleased with his performance over the last month or so?

The guy should be, what, 13-2 if he could hold a 4-run lead?

We should have a 10- or 11-game lead over the Giants, if our "ace" could just slam the door in those games.

[regfairfield]

Don Drysdale is turning over in his grave.

Personally I'd blame getting shut out for seven innings by true ace Jason Marquis of all people, but that's just me.

[Marty Leadman]

You should also know that if you hang out with DT long enough that there wouldn't be room for lively debate or disagreement.

That's pretty much the definition of inanity. If there was no room, then we wouldn't have read what you just typed.

[Gail Goodrich]

Man i really thought Billingsley would take a proverbial "next step" this year. Over the last few years there have been a lot of young players coming up and being great almost from the start for their teams. Dodgers young players are not like that. I have to continue to remind myself of that. Their development has been slow and sometimes painful. It's like one step forward, two steps back. There's certainly no Brauns or Longorias or Lincecums or even Cains in this group.

[superbas]

billz has struggled lately...but if he pitches like tonight for the rest of the year, he'll have 18-20 wins easy.

[regfairfield]

Then again, the last time we had a really, truly elite pitcher we called him one of the worst signings in history, so who knows?

[underdog]

Michael, I agree with you about the last two starts, he didn't have his best stuff, wasn't as consistent and would be the first to tell you that. That doesn't mean I still don't think he's the Dodgers' best pitcher or one of the best young pitchers in the league. His stuff tonight was incredible. He made basically 3 bad pitches. But yes if the question is, was Chad off his game in previous two starts, and simply that, I agree with you.

I still don't understand people questioning him as a #1 starter, other than defining #1 as one of the 5 best pitchers in baseball, or must be Sandy Koufax. That's not really how I define it.

Chad will be in the all-star game, and deserves it. That's all I gotta say about this before we argue in circles.

[Craig88USC]

A little Manny tonight would have went a long long way. :)

Hold 'em at 3, Brentley

YES
-now cue Journey - ladies and germs...

[Package]

Jon
I am only saying that there is a lot of things posted on this site that have nothing to do with the Dodgers or baseball. Also, everytime something is posted that disagrees with you or any part of the Dodger thought process, a person is critisized or accused of breaking some rule. Only the regulars are allowed to contribute on a regular basis here. Really, if you look at it objectionably you have to see it.

[underdog]

We *would* have a 10 or 11 game lead over the Giants if our best hitter hadn't been suspended for 50 games, is how I look at it.

[Marty Leadman]

Nice Andrew. Throw a Kevin Brown bomb into the mix :)

[Ollie]

Bills was fine tonight imo, we are being 1 hit, I think thats the problem..

[Jon Weisman]

"So what I gather is, everyone here calling Bills an ace is pleased with his performance over the last month or so?"

No. Being an ace doesn't mean you win every game.

[ucladodger]

I really cant believed some of the comments on here tonight. Really, most of the comments in question are just unsubstantiated garbage that has no factual backing behind it and not even worth debating

[Hollywood Joe]

My frame of reference on Bills is bigger than this start or his last 4 starts or last october, or whatever other incident or time period anyone wants to cite

If he throws a no-hitter next time out my opinion of him wont change, he if gives us 7 runs in 3 innings next time out my opinion of him wont change

I think this was a great effort from him with a couple of mistakes. Big deal. The team used 8 pitchers last night and Bills took them deep into the game and kept them in the game. Good job I say

valuing baseball players based on short term outcomes is close to playing darts in the dark.

[regfairfield]

Assuming we don't come back, Bills will be 0-23 in games where he was the losing pitcher.

[superbas]

how slow is loretta? c'mon....

[Bluebleeder]

speed would have obviously made a difference there.

[superbas]

hard to argue with that stat reg....0-23, that's terrible!

[underdog]

Also, I can see the Dodgers, despite tonight, come right back and smack the Rockies around tomorrow. That may not happen, but I can see it.

Oh yeah, and then Manny comes back.

As for me, I just tip my hat to Marquis because he pitched a great game. But if it's more fun to blame things internally, have at it.

[Tripon]

Billingsley is fine. I disagreed with leaving him in the top of the 6th since he seemed to be struggling, and relievers job is to well, 'relieve'.

But the decision was done, and you know what, 11 strike outs is pretty damn good.

Billingsley did his job, and its not his fault the offense is being shut down by Jason Marquis.

[mwhite06]

We should trade Billingsley for Washburn. Actually, I"m not sure Seattle would do that deal.

[regfairfield]

Chad Billinglsey has a career 133 ERA+ after his first 550ish innings.

As far as I know this is the best start to a career a Dodger pitcher has ever had.

To reiterate, Chad Billingsley is quite possibly the best young pitcher the Dodgers have ever developed.

[dodgerkramer]

Good point, though -- I don't know why I'm wasting time talking about Bills when the offense is clearly the problem in this game.

He obviously pitched well enough to win tonight.

I would have liked to see him close out that inning without the 2-run single, that's all.

[Craig88USC]

There it is... a baserunner.

As many baserunners as we can get

Before 'Dre and Blake bat in the 9th.

They are hitting 4th and 5th respectively....

[Michael]

Marquis has pitched a great game tonight, but there's also no question that the Dodgers are struggling badly at the plate. But I think that changes Friday with the return of Manny. Even if he struggles at first, his presence in that lineup will jumpstart everyone else. Manny is just what we need right now.

[underdog]

Chad Billinglsey has a career 133 ERA+ after his first 550ish innings. As far as I know this is the best start to a career a Dodger pitcher has ever had.

I don't have anything to add to that. Just thought I'd repost it. ;-)

[underdog]

Yeah, Michael, and I wouldn't be surprised if Manny did struggle a bit at first since I don't think he'll be quite ready. Hope people have a little patience for that. But within a week or so I expect him to be at full throttle.

[Paul]

OK, for all those who throw out that Bills "only" gave up 3 runs, if an ump is giving you an extra 6 inches on both sides of the plate, as well as anything that is not in the dirt, 3 runs is a lot. Marquis has proven tonight that with this ump, you don't have to throw pitches that the other team can get a bat on to get strikes. He's a decent pitcher, but come on, we made him look like Lincecum.

[underdog]

Marquis would get his tenth win and pitch in the all-star game. Is it that hard to believe he's pitched all season, as opposed to just tonight? (I admit, I didn't expect this from him this season. But he's pitched well. Period.)

[Package]

Underdog, They will continue to struggle when they put in Castro for O dog and Ellis for Martin.

[Bluebleeder]

Destiny is calling boys...

[Craig88USC]

Mota-oring!

Nice job, Guillermo!

[Bob Hendley]

Mr. Mota! I'd like to ruin Jason's night right about now.

[Bluebleeder]

2 runners. one swing...

[Tripon]

Oh noes, Billingsley is human!

How dare he pitch a quality start!

How dare he!

[Michael]

I was ready to give up on Mota earlier in the season. Especially after that extra inning implosion against the Giants. But he has really pitched well lately. One earned run all month. He's looking like the dominant set up man he once was for Gagne. I'm pleasantly surprised.

[Bluebleeder]

i hope one of our batters busts a Wolfy.

[Hollywood Joe]

Marquis has only 3Ks

pretty remarkable night

[CanuckDodger]

Kuo made a rehab start tonight. He pitched one perfect inning in the Arizona League. No K's though.

And about some of the idiotic comments we have been getting, they come from people who never say ANYTHING other than the one or two things they know will get a rise out of people here. It is just trolling.

[Eric Stephen]

Selected Games By Aces in 2009

Cole Hamels
Apr 10 - 3.2 IP, 11 hits, 7 runs, 1 bb, 1 k
Apr 17 - 6 IP, 8 hits, 5 runs, 1 bb, 4 k
May 30 - 6 IP, 8 hits, 6 runs, 1 bb, 7 k

Johan Santana
Jun 14 - 3 IP, 9 hits, 9 runs, 2 bb, 3 k

Tim Lincecum
Apr 7 - 3 IP, 4 hits, 3 runs, 3 bb, 5 k
May 15 - 6 IP, 10 hits, 5 runs, 3 bb, 8 k

Zack Greinke
June 5 - 5 IP, 9 hits, 7 runs, 1 bb, 3 k
June 17 - 6.2 IP, 8 hits, 6 runs, 2 bb, 9 k

C.C. Sabathia
Apr 6 - 4.1 IP, 8 hits, 6 runs, 5 bb, 0 k
Apr 22 - 6.2 IP, 6 hits, 7 runs, 4 bb, 2 k

These guys must not be aces I guess.

[dodgerkramer]

How many RBIs do Dodger position players have the last four games?

Hahaha. How in the world is this team leading the NL in batting?

One theory: The NL is just lousy this year, all around (the Dodgers being the exception, of course).

Look around. The NL East is awful. The Cardinals can't hit. The Cubs stink. I don't know a lot about the Brewers, but they're slightly above average.

The second-best team is the Giants.

Yeah, the NL is just pretty darn lousy this year.

[Michael]

Package, Hudson needed a day off. He has been slumping all month and did not look good at all last night.

[underdog]

Package, again my questions to you is this:

1) Have Martin and Hudson been hitting well over the past week?

2) Have you watched them play -- i mean, have they looked tired to you?

3) Has Castro played poorly tonight?

I sincerely want to know.

(And I already said that Ellis is a good defensive catcher. As ucla pointed out above, that one wild pitch was extremely difficult play. I've seen Russ muff similar ones this season, and even some easier plays.)

[underdog]

Questions *are*... excuse my sudden lack of grammatical ability. ;-)

[Craig88USC]

What Bluebleeder, Tripon, Bob & Underdog just said...

Go Dodgers!

[Bluebleeder]

Tip 'o cap to the Rox pitcher.

[underdog]

"That was a gem," says Vin. And I agree.

Frustrating, but true.

Vin Scully, never one to pick apart the home team. I trust him.

Night grouchy folks. ;-) Here's to a better result tomorrow.

[Michael]

This game took 2 hours and 18 minutes to play.

[dodgerkramer]

Wow, Jason Marquis just threw a two-hit shutout against us.

And the Rockies announcers are sharing a cold shower.

[Craig88USC]

Great Game JASON!

you got us this time

Congrats!

Now the Dodgers can STILL win the series in a few hours...

[Craig88USC]

Great Game JASON!

you got us this time

Congrats!

Now the Dodgers can STILL win the series in a few hours...

[Jon Weisman]

I am only saying that there is a lot of things posted on this site that have nothing to do with the Dodgers or baseball.

-- Yes, that's true.  But they don't limit the Dodger conversation.  They're extras.  It's like criticizing the ice cream selection at Baskin-Robbins because they also have smoothies.

Also, everytime something is posted that disagrees with you or any part of the Dodger thought process, a person is critisized or accused of breaking some rule.

-- Exaggeration. Look, for example, at the thread I wrote about the bullpen not being overworked.  Almost everyone disagreed with me.  And I and others have criticized the Dodger thought process plenty.  The thing is, I do think that it does get tiresome to hear the same complaint day after day.  But I completely allow differences of opinion.

Only the regulars are allowed to contribute on a regular basis here.

-- There is no limit to who contributes.  Anyone who wants to be a regular can be.  You can say whatever you want about Russell Martin, Chad Billingsley or whatever. Yes, it has to follow the rules, but the rules say nothing about someone's point of view.

Really, if you look at it objectionably you have to see it.

--I could be wrong, but objectively, what I see is that you don't like being disagreed with any more than you think I like being disagreed with.

[Bob Hendley]

Ha, dodgerkramer now goes after opposition and how lousy they are in order to explain our success. Sickem!

[underdog]

I'm inclined to agree, Canuck.

What can you tell us about AJ Ellis? Am I right that he has a good defensive rep?

I was actually glad to see him get a start for once. He didn't do anything with the bat but no one did tonight.

[Package]

Underdog,
No neither Martin or O dog have been knocking the cover off the ball but my thought is why sit them down and not put the best team available on the field?
I have watched them play. I have watched almost every game of the season and as many as I could have watched over the past 50 years. They might be tired but they would would have had a better chance than what replaced them.
I don't think Castro has played poorly and he does have a hit but the threat of O dog may have made a difference.
I appreciate you giving me an opportunity to answer you thoughts. Thank You. Others do not give that same opportunity.

[Jon Weisman]

I don't think everyone who's complaining is a troll, but Canuck's a great example of what I'm talking about.

Canuck and I have disagreed on issues more times than I can remember. We fundamentally, I think, disagree on Paul DePodesta's value. Canuck has been part of some protracted debates over the years.

Yet Canuck is in my inner circle of guest writers I turn to for the site, and I think he is one of the site's most cherished commenters, and I think everyone here only wishes he would comment more.

[dodgerkramer]

Bob Hendley:

No, that wasn't my intent when I wrote that.

But the more I think about it, the down year for the NL helps explain why this Dodger team (sans Manny) has been SOOOO dominant.

How else do you explain how a team with "B-minus" starting pitching and a "C" offense is 20 games over .500?

Yes, we do have a dominant bullpen. And yes, we do play terrific defense every night.

I'm just saying, if you take this Dodger team on paper in a typical NL year, we would not be 20 games over .500 on June 30.