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Why would Joe Torre stay?


That’s really the question, isn’t it?

Why come back?

My father was one of those who like to say, when you’re struggling with a decision, take a piece of paper, list all the pros and cons and then simply give it a good, rational going-over.

Let’s see, reasons to stay: Money (averaging $4.3 million per season), still loves his job, doesn’t want to end career on sour note.

Reasons to take a flier: Ownership a mess, no reason to believe roster will be seriously upgraded, is 70 and still has a daughter in high school, has already accomplished everything as a manager, has made his money.

I’m thinking, get outta Dodge.

Of course, pretty much everyone else is too. I mean, why all the suspense over his decision? If he was going to come back, he could have announced it anytime.

If he wasn’t, and thought it might impact the team, then he could hold off any announcement until the team is eliminated. Which is his upgraded plan.

So all signs point to Joe Torre calling it a managerial career … which is not the same thing as knowing he will walk off into some upper-management sunset.

Torre was still taking bullets for the team during the final days of Manny Ramirez, which is what a guy who was planning on coming back would do.

There is also the possibility of Torre leaving the Dodgers and going on to manage elsewhere. I don’t believe he’s planning this as his exit strategy, but he has wisely not closed any doors either. He loves L.A. and doesn't really want to move his daughter again.

After having spent all season with Torre, I would love to tell you that I know exactly what he’s going to do, but I can’t. My gut tells me there’s no way he comes back. Of course, my gut told me Cher would never show up at the MTV Video Music Awards wearing a 20-year-old body suit.

If Torre doesn’t believe this team has a legitimate chance to win it all, I can’t see him returning. And I can’t see him believing it has a chance.

-- Steve Dilbeck
 
Comments () | Archives (25)

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If baseball folk are making this decision, Torre goes, as he won't be offered a contract. No offense, but he was brought here to lead a squad of contenders and that is now one of pretenders.

What the team needs is a new leader with a new script--like Lasorda when he took over for Alston. Someone who can instill belief and a new team story. I'm not a big fan of Lasorda, but, when it was clear Alston couldn't lead our youngsters, Lasorda instilled confidence and did bring the team together.

Of course, the biggest thing the team needs is a new owner.

Joe is another one I can go without. Hopefully he doesn't take Bowa with him -- not because I think Bowa is so great (but he's a pretty darn good 3rd base coach) but because he tells it like it is (and is usually right).

Besides, Joe isn't staying even if he wanted to. The McCourts need to pay for beachouses somehow -- and now they finally have to do it legitimately by cutting salaries.

"Why would Joe Torre stay?"

- the rigor of a rite?

Connie Mack was 87 & still (i)managin(in)g... for reference, think Lasorda with another 4 birthdays in tow.

Jack McKeon: 74, nigh on 75... ditto Casey Stengel.

Hope for Torre's return?

McKeon was the oldest manager to ever win a World Series (2003, one month shy of his 73rd birthday)... if said be roadmap, Joe still has miles to go bumpy & progressively worse 162 mile stretch Highway 2011.

A more apropos question may be: based on history, what fate be worse?

a) McCourt(s) returning (either)
b) Torre returning
c) either(both) McCourt(s) choosing Joe's successor?
d) all of the above
e) some of the above
f) only 1 Extra Length Nat Sherman 164 left in the pack

The question is, why would you want him to stay? Is it his inane line-ups? Is it his mishandling of a bullpen? Is it the double standard and blind devotion he has for vets, especially of the washed-up variety? I know, its the way he holds up the rail during the game right?


JoJo was brought in here strictly as a PR move to begin with. He was totally the wrong choice at the wrong time to lead a bunch of young guns to greater heights. Send JoJo, Donny Boy and Bowa back to NY from whence they came, and while you're at it, send Flanders back to SF. Fire Bunnynutts too, then start all over.

I hope Joe comes back next year. He's demonstrated stability
in the face of adversity. He did the best he could despite the injuries,the implosion of the McCourts, and working with what's available. I wish that the Dodgers did not give up the farm system like they did and had smarter pitching talent. Last thing on my mind, I hope that Russell Martin gets well and shows up for Dodger spring training. He has baseball smarts and the knows how to settle down, not all but most young Dodger pitchers.

I generally agree that he's probably not coming back, but why wouldn't he think they have a chance to contend next year? They had a bad year, but do you think 6 months ago, anyone thought the Padres would be where they are now? (Just look around the net at archives for the answer.) And the Dodgers, for all their troubles, are STILL better than the Padres. On paper, anyway.

Let walking away appear to be Joe's call, so he can go out gracefully, but it shouldn't be his decision to make.

When he should have been squeezing every bit of contribution from his players, especially from Money Ramirez, he was RESTING them. No reason for that. In fact, an argument can be made that rest led to rust and rust led to injuries and breakdowns.

In a Chicago interview, Money actually expressed befuddlement as to why Joe decided not to play him, regularly.

Maybe Joe coddled his players because he wants to morph into an agent.

More likely, he's weary, and he projected that desire for nap-time onto his players.

Regardless of what hpppens in the McCourt divorce.... they can't possibly get the team sold before spring training starts. But believe me the McCourts are done as owners just as soon as they can find a buyer willing to bail them out of all the debt they've racked up and still let them keep the land and broadcast rights. Regardless of the Dodgers status as a big market team, you can bet next year will be a small to mid-market payroll ($60-$70 Million). Joe's not going to work for peanuts (hence the choice is ultimately his)but that's what they will be planning to spend on a manager so I expect we'll see Mattingly in his professional debut as a manager at any level with a pay check to match. Why would Joe stay? He won't.

I love Joe Torre & I think he restored order in the club house but still needed Manny to get us to a dominate state . BUT !!!!!! I think LA needs some new blood calling the shots . I can't help but hate to screw up a shot at Wallach . Although its true I do NOT have a clue at his managerial theories or methods , You gotta realize that this is the way Lasorda came through as a great manager & lets not forget about Scioccia who was begging Fox to give him a shot & look where that got us ..... Russel , Hoffman, Johnson , Tracey & Little .....................

Mattingley can NOT be the answer & seems to not even know the basics of the job . He couldn't even get any production out of this Dodgers line up for as long as he's been here .

I would hope to see Torre take a job as a Dodger advisor at some level .

I don't think he'll be back. Heck, why would he want to manage this team another year? For 0ne thing, he's 70 (nothing wrong with that...it's just that he already appears to be tired and worn out). Plus, the organization won't be able to afford players who could upgrade the team (thanks to the ownership thing). That being said, I don't want Mattingly to get the job. Just because he spent all those years in New York with Torre (plus the time here) doesn't make him qualified to manage a big league club. I think Tim Wallach should be the new manager of the Dodgers. He's paid his dues.

$4.3 million to manage a baseball team? My Cocker Spaniel could call the shots on this team and probably break .500.

I hope Joe does not come back and hope he takes Donnie and Larry with him. And I also hope that Honeycutt is shown his walking papers as well. Dodger hitting has stunk all season and Mattingly could do nothing to break anyone out of their prolonged slumps. I may be off by a few, but it looks like they scored 0,1,2 or 3 runs 65 times this year, and understandably, won very few of those games, 18. They have been shut out 16 times already. They've scored 1 run 18 times (but actually won 5 of those). As for pitching, it seems like all the relievers except Kuo regressed this year. McDonald has thrived since we traded him. And bless his soul, but I still don't know why Stults was ever let go. Clean house. Bring in a new attitude and start over (again).

Look, the people who are saying that we're a year away from the McCourts finally leaving-sound correct. Then, you're just hiring a manager for one year anyway..thinking a new owner will clean the house (which needs to be done). Joe may have over used a mediocre bullpen, but don't blame Broxton on him...Broxton just plain sucks. I agree, Honeycutt doesn't preach pitching inside, so get rid of him. Keep Bowa and maybe Mattingly (thinking Joe won't stay without him). We are better than the Padres, sans the bullpen. We are better than the friggin Giants, sans one starter and one reliever. So, why can't we contend...on a Pirates payroll? The NL Worst is a way better division to be in when you suck...get rid of Broxton and his 9 or 10 blown saves, and we're still in contention. Trade Kemp to Kansas City for Soria.

Ditto LABELDUDE. Torre cannot manage in the NL. He doesn't play little ball and he doesn't play long ball. The idea of "Torre Ball" is to string together a dozen singles and get three runs out of it. Never seen anything quite like it. No stealing, no sacrifices, not hit and run, no hitting to advance a runner. Couple that with having almost the lowest number of homers in the majors and you have a .500 fourth place team. He has been a disaster. We won for two years DESPITE him.
Why would Joe come back. He needs 5 million dollars and he plays/owns the horses.

There's a much better manager around. Look what's he done for the Rockies. Any team would be foolish to let a manager like that go.

Solution:
.
Let's all go to the Dodger bench during a game, throw a cup of Bigelow tea on Joe to wake him up and then ask him.

NO!!!.....NO!!!!.....NO!!!!

that is clearly NOT the question, & is just more evidence of wrong-headed thinking that got the doyas into their current morass....

the real question is why is torre even being given ANY say in his fate at all, as he ought to have been FIRED long ago!!!.....
in any other walk of life, accountability is the measure of continuity, & he has failed miserably, so ought 2b FIRED!!!
it's that simple, & media just likes to make it FAR more complex than it is!!!!

I echo the sentiments of others who have pushed for Tim Wallach to replace Joe. I think the younger players (e.g., Kemp and Ethier) would respond better to a manager closer to their own age.

Joe did a great job with the Dodgers in the Manny era, but I think he's best suited for a talent-laden team, as was his Yankees teams and as is the Lakers with Phil Jackson. Thanks for the memories, Joe!

Joe will go. Mattingly has a CONTRACT to manage the Dodgers next season, if Joe isn't here. We knew that it was part of Torre's deal when he signed to manage. So, if you want somebody else besides Donnie, you'd better hope the Dodgers have the money to buy him out first. If Joe wants to stay in an other capacity, like a consultant, then the Dodgers will have to pay him more money, which, of course, they don't have. So there you have it --- pay Mattingly to stay or go, and pay Torre to stay as a "consultant" while Mattingly manages -------- or pay for a new manager. With their unlimited financial resources, what do you think the Dodgers will do?

OK, just finished reading all the comments, and lots of us are on the same page: either Joe chooses to leave or he must be sent.

And send "Donny Baseball" and Rick Honeycutt on their respective ways with him.

If Joe was going to stay, I think he'd have announced it by now. I think he's going to wait until the team is officially eliminated to say he's through. He has his rings, and this organization will still be technically under present ownership by spring training 2011. Frankie won't be able to afford Torre, and the young nucleus here needs new, younger blood in the dugout to respond to. Give Tim "Shut Up and Play" Wallach the shot he deserves. Wallach is cheaper and if he doesn't get the call here, the organization will lose him.

Just my nickel's worth...

I think he leaves. But I don't get the negativity about him. He comes in and takes the Dodgers to the postseason in two of his three years and to our first two postseason series victories in the past 20 years. If it was so easy to do, then why did we only win one game with players like Kevin Brown, Steve Finley, JD Drew and others over that time? The first year, we were supposed to lose to the Cubs. Last year, especially with our late season struggles, no way we were supposed to win against Carpenter or Wainwright. But we did, and I suppose Torre had nothing to do with that?

Yes, he favors veterans, but clearly will give the job to a younger player once he believes they can handle it regularly. Yes, he overworks his bullpen, and he's not the only manager who does. The reality is that regardless of the manager, if Kemp and Ethier can rebound, and if the bullpen can pull it back together next season, the Dodgers can contend with only a few additions, and none of them necessarily need to be major.

Apparently the tools from the espn.com boards came here.

Kemp for Soria?

Broxton "sucks"?

Sigh...

Please Joe Don't come back. You are an overated manager you havae done so manys strange things that dont make sense, that make me wonder if Grady The Moron Little ever left. You are partly to blame for the Dodgers losing in the playoffs and losing some games, with your bad way of using the bullpent and your sometimes strange lineups. .

By the way I love how there are some people who don't undertand why some of us don't like Joe Torre as a manager.....these are the people who dont put on most of the games and / or go over the line ups, and box scores, and details, and basically what Joe does......they assume...."well the Dodgers went to the playoffs and Joe Torre led us there".....really?.....really?......so Grady The Moron Little got us into the playoffs to? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?


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