The public speaks to healthcare providers: Get your swine flu shots!

The American public may be reluctant to get vaccinated against the pandemic H1N1 influenza virus, but they are certain about one thing -- they want their healthcare providers to get immunized. A new survey by researchers at the University of Michigan's Mott Children's Hospital found that 87% of 2,365 adults polled believed that healthcare workers should be required to be vaccinated. "The public clearly expects health care workers to lead by example," said Dr. Matthew Davis, director of the poll.

Only 38% of the healthcare workers, however, said that they were likely to do so. Their reasons were confusing, at best. Many said they did not need to be vaccinated because there are drugs -- particularly the antiviral drug Tamiflu -- to treat the illness if it develops. Others said that they planned to get the seasonal flu vaccine and that it would protect them from swine flu.

The latter rationale is completely wrong. Studies have shown that vaccination for seasonal flu provides no protection against swine flu whatsoever. "In addition, relying on medications to treat H1N1 flu is a gamble" because resistance to the drug is likely to develop and there may not be adequate supplies if a severe outbreak occurs, Davis said.

The Times receives many e-mails from anti-vaccine folks arguing that healthcare workers are refusing to get vaccinated "because they know something about the vaccine that the public doesn't." What really seems to be the case, however, is that they know less about the flu than most citizens.

-- Thomas H. Maugh II

Comments

[Azina]

What an absolutely ridiculous article. I guarantee you I could find 2365 adults who feel exactly opposite. Early reports are already showing H1N1 to be weaker than expected this flu season. The regular seasonal flu is far more dangerous.

Tamiflu isn't even necessary to treat all cases. CNN medical correspondent Sanjay Gupta contracted H1N1 in Afghanistan and was treated at a battleground hospital with Tylenol, sinus decongestant, and IV fluids.

To suggest citizens are more educated than health professionals is just beyond absurd, and is completely disrespectful of the education, experience, and hard work that is required to be a health professional.

No one, regardless of the field in which they work should be forced to be vaccinated. It would be a violation of the 4th amendment and the Nuremberg Code. People have to be allowed to make their own choices. America is still the land of the free, right?

[Sue]

Azina - you are wrong! The seasonal flu is NOT more dangerous than H1N1. Please read these articles: http://www.ajc.com/news/what-makes-swine-flu-152118.html and http://www.canada.com/health/issues+caution+over+monitoring+swine+cases/1924069/story.html

Some excerpts from the articles:

“I would not call this a benign virus. People are winding up in ICUs,” said Dr. Richard Wenzel, past president of the International Society for Infectious Diseases. "

" In contrast to the seasonal flu that poses the greatest risk for older adults, the swine flu is targeting, hospitalizing and in some cases even killing those between 5 and 24 years of age, experts note. In addition, the virus also has the capacity to infect lung tissue differently than the common flu, striking deeper areas that are vital to supplying oxygen to the blood. That could make people more susceptible to lung infections such as pneumonia, experts say. "

"Children top the government’s priority list for swine flu shots this year. Typically, the flu season has 50 to 70 pediatric deaths nationally. But since swine flu appeared in April, there have already been about 50 pediatric deaths, even before the flu season hits in earnest, according to the Atlanta-based Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. The numbers are worrisome,” said Dr. Dan Jernigan, deputy director of the CDC’s influenza division."

"The World Health Organization is warning that underlying health problems "will not reliably predict all or even most cases" of severe H1N1 influenza."

"Worldwide, around 40 per cent of severe cases are now occurring in previously healthy children and adults, usually under the age of 50, WHO said Friday in issuing new guidelines on the use of antivirals developed by an international expert panel."

"In Canada, among cases where information is available, about 46 per cent of those hospitalized so far with human swine flu had no underlying medical condition."

"Patients with severe H1N1 infection can experience "a sudden and very rapid deterioration in their clinical condition", WHO said, usually on Day 5 or 6 after the onset of symptoms. H1N1 can cause viral pneumonia, which destroys lung tissue and is a leading cause of death for H1N1 and seasonal flu, and multi-organ failure, including failure of the heart, kidneys and liver."

The seasonal flu kills about 36,000 a year , and >90 % of them are over 65. The rest are very young children and people with chronic health problems. Seasonal flu very rarely kills healthy young people. Every day this week I have seen news stories about healthy young people dying unexpectedly from H1N1. And those "pre-existing health conditions" in people who die with H1N1 - very common conditions like obesity and asthma are regarded as some as those conditons.

You know what is really "ridiculous"? People like Azina who make statements that they cannot back up. Personally, I am appalled that heathcare workers would think the seasonal flu vaccine would protect them from H1N1. Healthcare workers should be willing to protect the people they are caring for from infection. Influenza is contagious before one even begins to show symptoms. of it. Who knows how many already sick and weakened people one infected worker could infect? If they don't like the terms of employment, they should find other fields of work IMO. It is a free country after all.

[Ann]

Healthcare workers should be required to receive vaccinations because they can expose vulnerable patients to the virus before they know that they are sick. It should be a requirement of the job. It is inexcusable that any hospital would allow its employees to endanger patients. I am skeptical that it is the doctors refusing vaccinations. I suspect it is the less educated healthcare workers that don't want the vaccine. This is America, if healthcare workers don't want to do their job well and protect their patients, they should quit.

[Barbara Kujawski]

First question - do those same "87%" favor getting the H1N1 vaccination so that they can't give it to me, the healthcare worker, who washes my hands and sneezes into my sleeve? Thought not. Second question - would those same "87%" feel the same about being FORCED to take said vaccine that hasn't been fully tested, as NY State is REQUIRING me to do? Thought not. Until it's "mandatory" for every American to be vaccinated, it is not ethical or constitutional to require vaccination of healthcare workers.

[Kat]

I see that this is a controversial issue and people are getting emotional about it, since it is after all about their bodies. I am a health care worker, and where I work at, a lot of people are refusing because for the simple reason that this is a new vaccine, and we are not sure of the side effects. No one wants to be a guinea pig.

The vast majority that I see of health care workers, nurses, doctors, etc. are not refusing because they have less knowledge than the average citizen. They are also not refusing because they assume they can be treated. They also do not have knowledge on the virus side effects that are hidden from the public. Health care workers are reacting as a citizen in this case. All citizens have the right to refuse a vaccine, and health care workers are citizens too with families.

I hope that soon we will find a vaccine with no harmful side effects for the H1N1, and then I am sure that all health workers would rush to get it. Just as most of us get flu shots to prevent getting the flu.

[kathy RN]

when 87% of the public is FORCED to get an untested vaccine (well tested for 3 weeks)and we can evaluate the side effects that happen to them maybe then I will consider it.

are we making elementary school teachers get it? they have constant contact with the most vulnerable population

[Tomasz Makowicz]

It is easy to tell others to get under-tested vaccine, than take it on your own. It is as easy as dropping bombs overseas. Not our houses are bombarded, not our children become homeless orphans. That's why public does not want to get vaccinated, but wants health care workers to get it by force.

[always thinking...]

are you kidding me???????! ? Safety, let alone EFFICACY of vaccines normally take years to establish. All we've had are a few months! Add to that the fact that the emergency preparedness act allows immunity to the makers of this vaccine in the case of harm or loss. Oh, and by the way, mercury limit bans no longer exist for this vaccine either. Forgive me if I do not feel comfortable volunteering myself as a guinea pig for this vaccine. Has anyone watched the Mike Wallace interview relating to the 1970s swine flu vaccine injuries? I have a right to informed consent regarding this vaccine... and the information out there makes me a bit skeptical. If hospitals mandate this vaccine, then I will no longer be at the bedside as an ICU nurse. Some of you out there might say "Good". But I promise you I will not be the only one. We are already experiencing a nursing shortage.... what a conundrum that will be!
ps.... flu viruses are always mutating. how can we also be sure the one in this vaccine is certainly the one?? also, has anyone heard about the canadian study that those who get a seasonal flu innoculation are more likely to contract the h1n1. more food for thought....
off the soapbox now....

[Karen M LaFave]

I am a health care worker and I am opposed to having the H1N1 vaccine. It should be my choice to have it injected into my body. I am not a giunea pig. there are to many unknowns about this vaccine and its side effects. look at the gardicel vaccine for young teenagers and the side affects it has. I have never recieved the flu vaccine and let my bodies own immune system take over. I have yet to have the flu in 20 years . Proper handwashing is the first defense in prevention . What about other illness's and diseases that are currently in the community...VRE, MRSA these are in the community in high numbers and transferable in many ways are you creating hysteria about these. I am a professional and know how to protect myself and my patients. I live in America it used to be home of the free and able to make my own choices .

[Jamie Carrier]

I'am a RN who has done extensive research on this "bird flu". I wish the general public would do some research before stating claims that all health care works be mandated to take this poison.....I mean vaccine. These vaccines contain Thimersol better known as Mecury. Mercury is highly toxic and there is no safe level. Also has been known to cause autism, multiple sclerosis, and ADD. Furthermore, Formaldehyde has also been found which is a known carcinogen that can cause cancer.

The CDC has a few pharmaceutical companies that are producing these vaccines in which still will not guarentee protection due to the different strains of the H1N1 virus. It is nothing more then a guessing game. Furthermore, they will begin testing subjects after the general public get the H1N1 vaccine. So if you want to be a guinea pig and risk your life with this no non-sense poison then by all means please be my guest. However, don't force healthcare workers to get mandated just because we know the truth as to whats in the vaccines. Come on America, you can't be this blind to see the facts that this all boils down to money making pharmaceutical companies rich. Look back in the 1970's when there was another swine flu outbreak. People got the vaccination thinking they were going to protect themselves. Some people died while others became paralyzed from a nervous system disorder known as Guillain-Barre Syndrome. However, the government denies that fact but it is the truth.

Don't believe me then research the subject and you will see the truth emerge for yourself, but don't be forcing healthcare workers to get this poison. We are human beings as well who risk our own lives to serve the general public. I have a six year old son who also will not get vaccinated. Our own immune system can fight this off. The symptoms of H1N1, the flu, and SARS all have the same symptoms. Perhaps this is nothing more for our government then to do "population control". It sure would not surprise me. It is my right not to get the vaccine, but if you want to take that chance then you go right ahead and enjoy your poison cocktail.

[LA Pediatrician]

It is our job as healthcare providers to protect our patients, and this means being fully immunized. The "new" H1N1 vaccine does not differ substantially from the seasonal flu vaccine which has had extensive years of research. Study after study done in response to vaccine hysteria has proven over and over that not only are they safe, but they are one of the most effective forms of preventative medicine we have.

To those perpetuating hysteria, especially those in healthcare, it is your duty to share scientific information based on the studies and not use your position as a provider to validate your opinions.

[Bennett]

I am a health care worker. At what point do I cease to be a person with free will? Are you suggesting that because I work in health care I should not be able to decide what goes into my body? All for the safety of the patients? Well I don't want to become a patient, or a corpse, all because of a vaccine that has not been proven safe and has a history of being dangerous. I deal with sick people all day with diseases that are just as bad as H1N1, and because I follow universal precautions I rarely get sick. How dare you tell me that I have to be injected with a vaccine that might kill me, or severely disable me, for your safety.

[Teresa Evans]

I'm an RN and I'll get my H1N1 flu shot after the rest of the "civilians" get theirs! I wouldn't want to deprive any one of getting the rushed, experimental, unproven vaccine. And, since when did becoming a nurse mean that I give up my Constitutional rights? The author of this article is an imbecile and doesn't understand the first thing about nursing. Personally, I'd rather get the pneumonia vaccine, I believe that'd do more to "protect" the community than the H1N1.

[Veronica]

Health care workers should just stop carping about rights, free will, and the constitution. It's beyond that. Your "rights" do end when they interfere with someone else's life.

If you're a health care worker, and you are afraid of this year's H1N1 vaccine, then you should be afraid of every flu vaccine. How many patients caught the flu from you last year?

From an ethical standpoint, it's unconscionable that anyone involved with the most vulnerable population (the seriously ill) would even consider not being vaccinated.

For that matter, school teachers and day care workers should get vaccinated, too. That's beside the point, though, as health care workers should know better.

The issue is, indeed, ignorance and fear. If a health care worker is worried that the swine flu vaccine is untested, then they must not realize that a new seasonal flu vaccine is created every year, with likely the same amount of testing.

If you are in a health care or child care profession, and refuse to be vaccinated (a.k.a. you're happy to catch and pass on the flu to those you take care of), then quit your job.

[dice8up]

That's totally funny...hahahaha...

The article itself is good... short but good... what I am most concern about is the refusal of those who works to vaccinate people to submit themselves to vaccination...!

It's like telling a kid not to smoke while a big pipe is in your mouth ... Totally lacking of discipline.. this is what makes kids go nuts.. how much more the informed public...

[mom]

Mandatory inoculation for healthcare workers is a farce. Forced inoculation of healthcare workers is step 1 to giving up your personal rights to protection under the constitution. There is more chance a patient will give it to the provider than the provider giving it to a patient. The virus is more contagious when the person is symptomatic and good infection control measures are necessary. Staying home when your ill is the best prevention as it is with other infections. If you want herd immunity you need to inoculate everyone, teachers, children, EMS workers and your local bus driver. What if your employer made it mandatory? Are you willing to take a brand new vaccine? In the future will healthcare workers be required to take all sorts of vaccines promoted by the powerful pharmaceutical co.'s to prevent passing "disease" on to their patients? There is a shortage of workers now. By the way, warts are contagious. Brings to mind that Will Smith Si Fi movie where the population is inoculated against cancer and they all turn into zombies.

[Ibunluvd]

How about everyone in your office is being mandated to take the shot. If not, you will have to wear a mask for your entire work day approximately 12.5 hours. Now lets see if the shoe still fits. Mandating anyone to do anything that has not been fully researched is archaic. That is like saying everyone must be vaccinated for chicken pox or any other vaccinations.

[Nancy]

Teresa Evans, I am an RN and it is my duty to put you FIRST. I volunteer my MANDATED flu shot to you!

[Janice Tobergte]

I'd feel better about the flu shot if they called it what it is H3N2: if the President his children and wife got theirs along with Sebellius on TV with the maker and batch number clearly identified. Even then I would be suspicious. Any government that wants to decrease expenses and the population is suspect and then to ration health care to those the government thinks does not have "a quality or contributing life" and wants to council them on "end life choice" is not to be trusted and I don't. Retired RN

[Elizabeth Voss]

Question? When I read about the literature regarding risks to the fetus it states "unknown". What does this mean?
Thanks

[MARY]

I am a Registered Nurse. Each day I perform the duties of my profession, I give my highest and best. I fail to see where determining what is highest and best for myself, by exercising a right to govern my own health, means being unethical to patients. Inother words, I promote Patients Rights, yet am unable to have my own honored?
Dear LA Pediatrician, while your words express your concern, please tell us have you rolled up your sleeves and taken your shots? And, if so, you did what YOU felt was beneficial for yourself and your patients. That is your right. Can you say with certainty that the vaccinations you are promoting and giving will do NO HARM? Isn't that one of your prime oaths? And when something happens to harm a patient, using science to explain it makes it ok? Are acceptable risks for deaths following vaccination or any medication , doing NO HARM?
I choose not to be a Acceptable Risk.

[sara histeed]

Health care workers have the choice not to be vaccinated against this potentially fatal disease. Patients should have the choice whether to be treated by them.
Let health care workers wear a badge indicating their choice, and if sufficient numbers of patients choose not to be treated by them, then employers should also have the choice whether to continue to employ them.

Isn't choice great when it's for everybody ?!